The SMLE 1903-1989
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15

Thread: Enfield No.4 MK I Sniper: Fake or Original? - Opinions please

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #1
    Legacy Member Sir T. Woolridge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Last On
    06-26-2021 @ 07:47 AM
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    11:08 PM

    Enfield No.4 MK I Sniper: Fake or Original? - Opinions please

    Good Evening everyone!

    I have the opportunity to purchase this gun. It is based in Italyicon, the gun also has an italian firearms proof-stamp (visible in picture with red 1 and red 4).
    But I am in doubt about its authenticity:

    1.) As to see, the serialnumber is stamped above the manufacturing year "1945" and way higher in position than I used to see on other guns - is this right? One could think there might have been another serialnumber in the middle, maybe scratched away - is this possible?

    2.) The case of the Telescope has the instructions for use on an L1A1 - so at least the case is not original.

    3.) The wooden crate says (T.LESS TELESCOPE), meaning that it belongs to a gun which was not outfitted with a scope. I know that in the surplus-market a lot of crates were taken for whatever gun was there - so this must not mean anything at first.
    But:

    4.) The Number stamped into the upper side of the stock behind the bolt - which matches with the one of the scope - seems to be a little bit far down away from the action... is this okay or maybe also a possible indication for a fake?

    Because it would be easy to take a T.LESS TELESCOPE rifle, attach a L1A1 Scope and put the scope-serial on the stock...

    According to the seller the gun has the correct "T" stamp on the left side. Unfortunately it is barely/not visible on the foto.

    What do you think?
    Original gun with original matching scope in wrong case and wrong crate?
    Or fake?
    And how did these rifles come to Italy? Were they used there in the armed forces?

    Thank you in advance and have a nice day,

    Sir T. Woolridge
    Information
    Warning: This is a relatively older thread
    This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.
    Last edited by Badger; 03-05-2020 at 06:07 PM.

  2. # ADS
    Friends and Sponsors
    Join Date
    October 2006
    Location
    Milsurps.Com
    Posts
    All Threads
    A Collector's View - The SMLE Short Magazine Lee Enfield 1903-1989. It is 300 8.5x11 inch pages with 1,000+ photo’s, most in color, and each book is serial-numbered.  Covering the SMLE from 1903 to the end of production in India in 1989 it looks at how each model differs and manufacturer differences from a collecting point of view along with the major accessories that could be attached to the rifle. For the record this is not a moneymaker, I hope just to break even, eventually, at $80/book plus shipping.  In the USA shipping is $5.00 for media mail.  I will accept PayPal, Zelle, MO and good old checks (and cash if you want to stop by for a tour!).  CLICK BANNER to send me a PM for International pricing and shipping. Manufacturer of various vintage rifle scopes for the 1903 such as our M73G4 (reproduction of the Weaver 330C) and Malcolm 8X Gen II (Unertl reproduction). Several of our scopes are used in the CMP Vintage Sniper competition on top of 1903 rifles. Brian Dick ... BDL Ltd. - Specializing in British and Commonwealth weapons Specializing in premium ammunition and reloading components. Your source for the finest in High Power Competition Gear. Here at T-bones Shipwrighting we specialise in vintage service rifle: re-barrelling, bedding, repairs, modifications and accurizing. We also provide importation services for firearms, parts and weapons, for both private or commercial businesses.
     

  3. #2
    Legacy Member Sir T. Woolridge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Last On
    06-26-2021 @ 07:47 AM
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    11:08 PM
    Thread Starter

    Further pictures (more pictures requested from the seller)

    As seen in the title above

  4. Avoid Ads - Become a Contributing Member - Click HERE
  5. #3
    Legacy Member Sir T. Woolridge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Last On
    06-26-2021 @ 07:47 AM
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    11:08 PM
    Thread Starter

    Comparison

    BSA serialnumber positions from 1944 and 1945 in comparison:

  6. #4
    Legacy Member Kiwi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Last On
    05-27-2023 @ 06:40 AM
    Location
    Queenstown, New Zealand
    Age
    46
    Posts
    243
    Real Name
    Andrew
    Local Date
    03-29-2024
    Local Time
    09:08 AM
    My money is on this option:
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir T. Woolridge View Post
    Original gun with original matching scope in wrong case and wrong crate?

  7. Thank You to Kiwi For This Useful Post:


  8. #5
    Legacy Member Bindi2's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Last On
    Today @ 09:18 AM
    Location
    Western Australia
    Posts
    1,446
    Local Date
    03-29-2024
    Local Time
    05:08 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiwi View Post
    My money is on this option:
    ^^^^^

  9. Thank You to Bindi2 For This Useful Post:


  10. #6
    Legacy Member bros's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 04:03 AM
    Location
    yukon
    Posts
    272
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    02:08 PM
    Not a betting man but from what i can see in the limited pictures....looks kosher to me.

    How about a few more pics of the scope pads affixed to the left side of the receiver.....take pics without scope bracket attached.

    Another of magazine cut-off block on right side of receiver...there should be a "S" stamped there.

    Another of the "T" stamp on the left side of the receiver(between the two scope pad mounting brackets)

    Picture of the "bottom or underside", of the fore-end, close to the front of the barrel...is there the rifle serial #stamped there with some other stampings?

  11. Thank You to bros For This Useful Post:


  12. #7
    Legacy Member Roy W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Last On
    Today @ 04:07 PM
    Location
    Hampshire
    Posts
    561
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    04:08 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by bros View Post
    Not a betting man but from what i can see in the limited pictures....looks kosher to me.

    How about a few more pics of the scope pads affixed to the left side of the receiver.....take pics without scope bracket attached.

    Another of magazine cut-off block on right side of receiver...there should be a "S" stamped there.

    Another of the "T" stamp on the left side of the receiver(between the two scope pad mounting brackets)

    Picture of the "bottom or underside", of the fore-end, close to the front of the barrel...is there the rifle serial #stamped there with some other stampings?
    The 'S' isn't always there. If the sight was replaced in manufacture the S was omitted because it needed zeroing.

  13. Thank You to Roy W For This Useful Post:


  14. #8
    Contributing Member Promo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Last On
    @
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    1,842
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    10:08 PM
    I have seen this rifle listed for sale on eGun as well and I think it is way overpriced, even at the starting bid.

  15. #9
    Legacy Member Sir T. Woolridge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Last On
    06-26-2021 @ 07:47 AM
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    11:08 PM
    Thread Starter
    Quote Originally Posted by bros View Post
    Not a betting man but from what i can see in the limited pictures....looks kosher to me.

    How about a few more pics of the scope pads affixed to the left side of the receiver.....take pics without scope bracket attached.

    Another of magazine cut-off block on right side of receiver...there should be a "S" stamped there.

    Another of the "T" stamp on the left side of the receiver(between the two scope pad mounting brackets)

    Picture of the "bottom or underside", of the fore-end, close to the front of the barrel...is there the rifle serial #stamped there with some other stampings?
    Many thanks so far!
    More pictures are requested, but the seller has not answered yet - the uploaded images are the only ones I have...

    ---------- Post added at 09:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:19 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Promo View Post
    I have seen this rifle listed for sale on eGun as well and I think it is way overpriced, even at the starting bid.
    In which way overpriced? Please explain
    I have seen an all matching No4 MkI T built 1944 with british proof marks based in Germanyicon with correct wooden crate but not matching telescope-case sold on egun in for 7000€ +
    Last edited by Sir T. Woolridge; 03-04-2020 at 03:28 PM.

  16. #10
    Legacy Member Sir T. Woolridge's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Last On
    06-26-2021 @ 07:47 AM
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    03-28-2024
    Local Time
    11:08 PM
    Thread Starter

    Additional photos arrived!

    I hope these will do. What do you mean?

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Enfield No.4 MK I Sniper - Fake or Original? Opinions please.
    By Sir T. Woolridge in forum The Lee Enfield Knowledge Library Collectors Forum
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 03-04-2020, 02:30 AM
  2. M1903A4 fake or original
    By Promo in forum Appraisals, Fakery, Dispute Resolution & Mediation Forum
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 06-27-2017, 10:41 PM
  3. Enfield No4 MK1 T Sniper Rifle no scope or bracket....real deal or fake??
    By mrbungle in forum Appraisals, Fakery, Dispute Resolution & Mediation Forum
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 06-18-2013, 11:41 AM
  4. Original Enfield No.15 Mark 1 Sniper Rifle Case (eBay Auction)
    By Badger in forum Commercial Auction and Sale "Gossip"
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 08-08-2007, 06:22 PM
  5. Fake Enfield sniper transit chest on e-bay
    By superbee in forum Commercial Auction and Sale "Gossip"
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 04-29-2007, 05:48 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts