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Thread: Late 1944 S.A. Garand (almost original?)

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  1. #11
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singer B View Post
    Any Garandicon is nice.
    I've had a pile of them...too. My point was that everyone seems to be too worried whether it's "Correct" or what. Not much chance of changing anything from as it is here in Canadaicon...not really. Yes, nice...I'd have it.
    Regards, Jim

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  3. #12
    Legacy Member hurrikane18's Avatar
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    You guys seem to be missing the the word “almost”, and also the question mark at the end. I never once tried to state this thing was all original - clearly it’s not. But is it mostly original? It’s a question. So let’s settle down a bit and move on. I’m looking for your expertise, because I think it’s at least partially, if not mostly original - with some replacement parts that were likely an attempt to restore it back to “correct”. I say this because I think it would have been a nearly impossible feat here in Canadaicon to assemble this rifle and get this many parts correct. I think most of the parts must have been there from the start and the “incorrect” ones replaced over time. There just isn’t the supply to build this. Now, which parts are which? What more information/pictures do you need?
    Last edited by hurrikane18; 07-17-2020 at 12:39 AM.

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  5. #13
    Legacy Member hurrikane18's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by musketjon View Post
    Shouldn't the stock be an NFR and not a GAW? Is the -9 op rod a flat or radiused side? Is the safety -11 or _11? There is a huge difference.
    There's also a HUGE difference between original and correct. A rifle is only original once--the day it left the armory.
    Jon
    Okay so first, I understand the difference between original and correct. Just because a rifle isn’t 100% “original” doesn’t mean it can’t have some “original” parts. I’m not experienced with the M1icon Garand, but I’m experienced in researching WWII rifles as I collect them. I’m finding the M1 Garand particularly difficult to find information on (even tougher than the M1 Carbine). All I really have to go off is usriflecal30m1 - I entered my serial number and it brought up a huge list of parts that would be correct for my rifle. Every part I found markings on was included on this list. Both NFR and GAW stocks showed up on the list too, so what makes you say GAW is incorrect? As for the -9 op rod, what do you need a picture of? I don’t think the list mentioned flat or radius. As for the safety, it looks like _1 now that you mention it, but I’ll have to disassemble and look again. What’s the difference? It sounds like you have a lot of knowledge and I’d love to learn, if you’re done poo-pooing my rifle lol.

  6. #14
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Like I said earlier, I think this one came from Lever arms in Vancouver back some years. They had a huge influx of M1icon rifles from Denmarkicon and they stripped them ALL to every part to build "Correct" models. They had everything from three digit serials up. This would be one that was assembled when they were left with good parts that could only be put together to a nice shooter. Nothing wrong and wouldn't worry. Trying to figure out what's the correct era for the serial number will just be frustrating...and pointless.
    Regards, Jim

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    Contributing Member Bob Seijas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    Trying to figure out what's the correct era for the serial number will just be frustrating...and pointless.
    AMEN. If one part is wrong it puts everything into question. There is a legal maxim about a witness that says "Falsus unum, falsus omnia." If he tells one lie, you have to discount his entire testimony.
    Real men measure once and cut.

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    Legacy Member hurrikane18's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Seijasicon View Post
    AMEN. If one part is wrong it puts everything into question. There is a legal maxim about a witness that says "Falsus unum, falsus omnia." If he tells one lie, you have to discount his entire testimony.
    Well we can agree to disagree on that. When it comes to WWII rifles, if it’s 100% original, it probably doesn’t have much of a story to tell. It was either unissued or it just didn’t see many battles. Not that I wouldn’t want it - from a collectors standpoint, 100% original is the holy grail. But from a history standpoint, I’d LOVE to have the rifle that’s 80% original with 20% replacement parts because they got worn out, dinged up, or broken during the war and had to be replaced. Just because it’s not your cup of tea doesn’t mean it’s worthless just because one or two parts aren’t original from factory.

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  10. #17
    Contributing Member Bob Seijas's Avatar
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    We don't really disagree, your points are valid. My point is only that it is usually impossible to differentiate a rifle such as you describe from a total rebuild that some collector partially restored with a few correct parts.
    Real men measure once and cut.

  11. #18
    Legacy Member hurrikane18's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Seijasicon View Post
    We don't really disagree, your points are valid. My point is only that it is usually impossible to differentiate a rifle such as you describe from a total rebuild that some collector partially restored with a few correct parts.
    Well after all this, my question remains: which parts are “correct” and which ones aren’t? I guess I should just go off the list I found on USRifleCAL30M1 and do my own research. Unlike you guys, I quite like this rifle and want to learn more about it - even if it’s not 100% original. I think it’s neat to find something like this in Canadaicon when the majority of the market are complete mix-masters and just finding a WWII Garandicon can prove to be a difficult and expensive task. I am certainly jealous of your U.S. market, even more so now that I’ve read these comments

  12. #19
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hurrikane18 View Post
    Unlike you guys, I quite like this rifle
    You've misunderstood, we do like it. They're just answering your question about originality.

    Quote Originally Posted by hurrikane18 View Post
    just finding a WWII Garand can prove to be a difficult and expensive task
    There's a guy in London ON I should try to put you in contact with, he has a set of five all correct/original time capsules, he searched long and hard for them. One was my LL M1icon SA 328219 that was all original/correct/unaltered. Now he has all five inspector stamps and the accompanying rifles. That took some looking and some coin. I probably sold mine about six years ago...
    Regards, Jim

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  14. #20
    Legacy Member musketjon's Avatar
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    Hurrikane,
    The site you reference is known to be loaded with incorrect information.
    Back when I started studying and collecting M1icon rifles (40 or so years ago) there was no 'net. Reading books, asking LOTS of questions and writing letters was the norm. I've paid my dues. I'm usually freely forth-coming with the info one asks for but your snydeness does not warrant it. Read the books, write the letters and ask the questions yourself. Good luck on your endeavors, mon ami.
    Jon

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