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Thread: My first time experience with Incipient Separation

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  1. #1
    Legacy Member boltcarrier's Avatar
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    My first time experience with Incipient Separation

    I reloaded some brass given to me by a friend and I examined each case carefully before charging them.

    so I went to the range and fired with my No4Mk1 sporter and when I tried to eject the case, I found only the base of the case and the body was stuck in the chamber.

    After calling a few gunsmiths and they didn't feel like it's worth their while to do a small job like this, I guess if I were to paid $100 - $150 to do this job, they would change their mind, but I was just too cheap to pay for a small job that I felt maybe $50 should do.

    This is apprenticeship in the raw, so I tried some idiotic ways and failed and now regretted it.

    but anxiously I found on YoutTube some really good advice, using Cerrosafe to dislodge the case.

    so happily I did manage to dislodge the case by following the instructions on YouTube

    then I realized that there's a nick in the chamber created when I tried to chisel the case out

    the question I have now is whether I can still fire the gun safely.


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    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    What you should probably do is polish the chamber to reduce the nick. Not hard to do, yes it'll be safe still. I doubt you made a deep gouge?

    Many times just driving a live round in as if you hadn't noticed the separation will bring the piece out. Other times if you let it cool down you can just bang the butt on a solid object and the separation will dislodge. Some have placed the barreled action in a freezer and the piece falls out after. I would suggest if you're going to glean brass from unknown sources then you need to buy a stuck case remover. Keep it in the butt trap.

    Others will be along with their own methods all tried and true.

    ---------- Post added at 11:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 AM ----------

    Here's an example of the stuck case tool... https://www.ds-solutions.co.uk/.303%...Case-Extractor.
    Regards, Jim

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    Contributing Member ssgross's Avatar
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    That nick is far back, at the web behind where the case separated. The gas seal in the chamber happens further in (where the stuck part of the case gripped the wall more strong than the part that separated).
    I agree with Jim on polishing. If it's a light surface scratch, use a piece of oiled emery paper in a slot at the end of a dowel chucked in a drill (Thanks Jim for sharing this with me in one of my threads) to knock down any light burr you created. If your gouge created a larger raised burr, you may want to try a chamber hone https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...m-prod651.aspx
    These are also on amazon. They come in 400 grit or 800 grit. Don't over polish. Use plenty of oil.
    If it's just a light scratch, any polishing will likely make it go away. Hard to tell in your video if it's just the lighting that makes it look bad, or if it actually is.

    ---------- Post added at 10:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    Here's an example of the stuck case tool... https://www.ds-solutions.co.uk/.303%...Case-Extractor.
    you're link was broken for me. Looks like there is actually a period in the link at the end
    https://www.ds-solutions.co.uk/.303%...ase-Extractor.

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    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ssgross View Post
    you're link was broken for me.
    Don't know what happened there...it sure is though.
    Regards, Jim

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    Legacy Member boltcarrier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ssgross View Post
    That nick is far back, at the web behind where the case separated. The gas seal in the chamber happens further in (where the stuck part of the case gripped the wall more strong than the part that separated).
    I agree with Jim on polishing. If it's a light surface scratch, use a piece of oiled emery paper in a slot at the end of a dowel chucked in a drill (Thanks Jim for sharing this with me in one of my threads) to knock down any light burr you created. If your gouge created a larger raised burr, you may want to try a chamber hone https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...m-prod651.aspx
    These are also on amazon. They come in 400 grit or 800 grit. Don't over polish. Use plenty of oil.
    If it's just a light scratch, any polishing will likely make it go away. Hard to tell in your video if it's just the lighting that makes it look bad, or if it actually is.

    ---------- Post added at 10:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 PM ----------


    you're link was broken for me. Looks like there is actually a period in the link at the end
    https://www.ds-solutions.co.uk/.303%...ase-Extractor.
    Thank you for the info, the nick is very light so i think polishing will help it.. lots of oil

    i just ordered an extractor from Marstar, $25 including tax and shipping

    thanks again

    ---------- Post added at 07:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:50 PM ----------

    Thanks for the info, i just ordered an extractor from Marstar

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    Contributing Member fjruple's Avatar
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    Very difficult to watch the video, especially applying any type of direct heat to any pressure parts and using a chisel to get the ruptured case out. In the past I use a lug bolt that was a little big than the diameter of the bore. I would flatten the front of the lug bolt to provide a flt surface for the cleaning rod to strike. I would cut off the hex nut on the lug bolt and cut a screwdriver slot into that end. I would use a long screwdriver to tighten the lug bolt in the rupture case gripping the brass. Using a cleaning rod I would tap out the ruptured case and lap bolt. Save the lag bolt for future ruptured cases. Of course you can buy a ruptured case extractor and use that like normal people.

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    Contributing Member ssgross's Avatar
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    I'm hoping that the torch was just a brief futile attempt to loosen the case, and not actually applied long enough to try and "melt the case". Brass melts at ~1700F. A hand torch wouldn't do it, but any real attempt would destroy the steel's heat treating.

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    I had the same thing three times with my No. 1 MkIII*.
    My case extractor does not work. It gets quite some purchase when I slam the bolt forward, but the cases are so badly stuck, that they just slip off after pulling hard. I gave up trying and brought the rifle to my gun shop.
    They used a correctly sized threader (I hope that is the right word. It is the tool used to thread internally the female connections) and got the rifle free each time.
    I also posted something about that here in the past.
    To me that happens always about one inch above the case floor. Maybe even a bit less.
    I was very disappointed when it happened the first time, because I was using Hornady cases and was at the 4th or 5th reloading.
    Hornady, Sellier & Bellot, other stuff. They all start showing a thin line at the breaking point after the third use.
    I reduced my use of the No. 1 drastically, but I see that it happens also with the No. 4 and the P14.
    Never had that problem with 7,62x54R or with any other rimless case. Just with the .303...

    Very annoying indeed!
    34a cp., btg. Susa, 3° rgt. Alpini

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    Legacy Member us019255's Avatar
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    Quite a few years ago I noticed stretch marks on Enfield 303 cases I was reloading. I did some research and found that unlike rimless cases, the 303 headspaces on the rim. The Britishicon ream their chambers a bit deeper than they have to be . This causes the case to stretch a bit on firing. This has the advantage of allowing operation with dirt (think WWI), but if one full length sizes this pushes the case length back. Repeated a few times a one can get separation. The recommended solution was to separate cases by rifle, then neck size. I have done this and get great case life. To help even more you can put a thin "O" ring on the case just above the rim for the first firing. This makes sure the head is in firm contact with the bolt and eliminates the initial stretch.
    Ed reluctantly no longer in the Bitterroot

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    Contributing Member ssgross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by us019255 View Post
    To help even more you can put a thin "O" ring on the case just above the rim for the first firing. This makes sure the head is in firm contact with the bolt and eliminates the initial stretch.
    Wouldn't this cause the opposite effect? Doesn't the stretching occur mostly from the shoulder of the case being pushed towards the shoulder of the chamber, since that is where the extra space is?. Backing the case out with an o-ring "above" the rim would increase this space and make it worse. There is a small amount of stretching that will occur due to the headspace between the base of the cartridge and the bolt face, but this should be a negligible issue in a rifle with a properly fitted bolt head.
    Or are you suggesting something between the case and the bolt to decrease headspace? This would not solve the issue of having slightly deeper chambers - the case isn't going to go in any farther.
    At $36, the RCBS 303 neck sizer is worth the investment, and will quickly pay off given current price hikes of all components.

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