World at War: 700 Yards Mayhem - British Sniper vs German Sniper - No4 MKI T!

[amadeus76]

Good to see you branching out Rob…

I promise not to tell the Files you’re being unfaithful. ;-p

[Ovidio]

What a nice channel. I immediately subscribed!

[Rob Ski]

Good to see you branching out Rob…

I promise not to tell the Files you’re being unfaithful. ;-p

Hahahahaha! Thank you!

---------- Post added at 11:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:55 AM ----------

What a nice channel. I immediately subscribed!

Thank you Ovidio!!!

[30Three]

Here's a photo of the original Winchester Red Label
The ammunition is not in as clean condition as your test box.
Attachment 120191

[Surpmil]

Well done! Now, did the Home Army get any No4(T)s by air delivery?

[Rob Ski]

Here's a photo of the original Winchester Red Label
The ammunition is not in as clean condition as your test box.
Attachment 120191

Mine main aluminum box was completely seal off. When I opened the can, there was no signs of moisture penetration or anything. My ammo was made in October 1941, so only few months after your box!

[30Three]

Surpmil; I've not heard of any N4Mk1T's being air dropped in France. But that doesn't mean that it didn't happen.
They dropped tons of stuff leading upto and just after D-Day.
Mainly Sten's, Lee Enfields and Bren's.
I have a 1944 Maltby made No4 from a local air drop, along with the original bayonet and a bandolier of rounds. It is one of my most prized possesions.

[Alan de Enfield]

...........but there is a logical explanation that is probably a good story, if only I knew it."

Just a little more 'back-story' to the problems with American manufactured ammunition :

During WW1 around 50% of the 303 supplied was deemed 'not fit for use' and was relegated to practice use only, add in the fact that by 1916 the 3 American suppliers to Britain were over 400,000,000 (400 million) rounds below their promised delivery rate.
The decision was taken to cancel all contracts with the US at the earliest opportunity.

[Rob Ski]

Just a little more 'back-story' to the problems with American manufactured ammunition :

During WW1 around 50% of the 303 supplied was deemed 'not fit for use' and was relegated to practice use only, add in the fact that by 1916 the 3 American suppliers to Britain were over 400,000,000 (400 million) rounds below their promised delivery rate.
The decision was taken to cancel all contracts with the US at the earliest opportunity.

That is very cool info. Now, so it looks like USA didn't have a good track record since WWI with British 303. Going back into the 40's, seems that Winchester again chocked and their RAF ammo was downgraded to "non aircraft use only". However, we think this is mainly because of the poor quality control on primers, fear of having dud round on the aircraft, right? Because performance wise, not talking about shooting, but from the doppler radar, rounds were consistent on the velocity and SD: 17fps is not bad for mass produced ammo.
I have one more question, accuracy wise, how is the Winchester ammo comparing to regular British surplus production?

[Alan de Enfield]

That is very cool info. Now, so it looks like USA didn't have a good track record since WWI with British 303. Going back into the 40's, seems that Winchester again chocked and their RAF ammo was downgraded to "non aircraft use only". However, we think this is mainly because of the poor quality control on primers, fear of having dud round on the aircraft, right? Because performance wise, not talking about shooting, but from the doppler radar, rounds were consistent on the velocity and SD: 17fps is not bad for mass produced ammo.
I have one more question, accuracy wise, how is the Winchester ammo comparing to regular British surplus production?

My understanding was the dimensional consistency. I have not been able to identify if this was bullet dimensions, or case dimensions. I am guessing that as it resulted in jamming / blockages / non-ejection that it was inconsisten case dimensions.


Just as another example ( later manufacture and now made to SAAMI dimensions) the difference between US manufactured (commercial) 303 and 'mil-spec' 303 dimensions.

The Win cases are the 'thin ones' and the Prvi-Partisan are the 'thicker ones'. Using the Win. cases with the thin rims, can result in you increasing your effective headspace by ~ 5 thou. The Win. and Rem. tend to be at the bottom end of the specification (Min spec 0.054") whilst the PP and Mil-Spec tend to be around the top-end (Max spec 0.064")

Notice also how thin the 'SAAMI' cases are around the "web"