Buttplate ID ??

[USGI]

What's the consensus on the ID of this one? - Bob

[painter777]

GI Bob,
I'm leaning towards the WRA plate on the CCC chart, it seems to match up best row by row.
2nd guess would be the Inland/SG plate that btw I just realized is the same picture... If you look closely at this example at a scratch or dent you'll see it on the other example.

The U.S. Caliber .30 Carbine Buttplates

I always like to credit Jim Mock for his work on putting all this info together.

[USGI]

After I saw your comment, I took awhile and searched old threads for discussions on these buttplates. I've got another buttplate on a Carbine I haven't had out in awhile, so plan to get it out for a picture later today. In the meantime, I want to see if Bubba-7 or Hercules Powder may want to add a comment.

Here's the general Google Search I just used, followed by a couple links to specific threads I found. - Bob

https://www.google.com/search?q=Mils...t=gws-wiz#ip=1

https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=52127&page=1

http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=42657

EDIT: Here's the picture of the 2nd buttplate on the left, followed by the one from post #11 above for comparison.

[Bubba-7]

The butt plate in post #11 is late Inland. You can tell by the gaps at 11 and 2 o'clock.
Jim Mock's butt plate list is the first time I have seen the three Winchester early, mid and late butt plates shown correctly. Early, dot splatter all around screw, mid, dot splatter only on bottom, and late, no splatter and like a late Inland.
And part of the confusion with his list of butt plates is because, it does not have the Inland early square pattern, which before everyone removed their original early square pattern butt plate from their original early Inland and replaced it with the diagonal pattern. CC NLs stated, the early Inland square pattern was more common.
Then Riesch only listed the diagonal pattern for early Inland. So everyone gets guess what happened then. Of course, you can remove the butt plate and see the indentations in the stock wood, if early Inland square or diagonal pattern was original to the stock.
Thirty years ago, been there, done that, myself. Newbies following Riesch have destroyed many, many original carbines.

[painter777]

So GI Bob,
Just what are you up to?

[USGI]

Busy looking at dots on buttplates right now. - Bob

[deldriver]

[USGI]

So GI Bob,
Just what are you up to?

The real answer, and I'm not getting much accomplished on it right now, is to determine if the buttplates on my 476K and 408K Inlands are original "square pattern" Inland plates or Winchester. Either I don't understand the CCC site's explanation, or will need to explain to a future owner why they aren't original. I took some pictures today of the stocks they belong to, but can't see meaningful imprints on either one of them. The 476K stock is on the left and the 408K is on the right in all (4) pictures. Only thing I can see for sure is the wood grain and milling marks. I can take higher resolution pictures if you think that would help any, but don't believe there's really anything there to see. - Bob

[Matt_X]

Can we expand this discussion to the Saginaw/Inland buttplates ?
Is there any pattern of usage observed with these and/or the missing dimple buttplates on SG stocks?

I'm assuming the Saginaw/Inland butt plates were made by Seymour Products.
In Ruth's WB! and III Seymour Products, Seymour Conn. is listed as a Butt Plate Supplier for both Saginaw and Inland. B200997

In WB III Proos Mfg. Company is listed as another subcontractor of Butt Plates to Saginaw. However it seems unlikely to the missing dimple buttplate, if made by Proos, would look so different from the buttplates they made for IP and then Grand Rapids Saginaws.

In 2005, an unknown person claimed to have microfilm copy of 1943 Saginaw subcontractors and spare-part subcontractors.
Micro-film Notes On Saginaw SG Butt Plate Manufactures... | Gun Hub Forums
He claims a Shelby Spring provided 26,000 spare buttplates. That might explain the plethora of NIW missing dot buttplates. I'm a little suspicious this is a little too convenient.

[USGI]

I don't remember where I found these images, but to me it proves that at least some of the "missing-dot" buttplates were made by SA. Hope this helps. - Bob