MK 1 bren tipod

I was fortunate on picking up a Mk1 Bren tripod Unfortunatly it didn't come with the extra 2 peice leg for antarcraft fire and the bayonet locking bit was gone, also gone was the bracket on the front leg that the Bren gun atached to for anti aircraft fire. I have spent quite a bit of time looking at Bren gun pictures trying to get a good view of the bracket. So far I have been unable to find a good enough picture to allow me to fabricate one up as It would make a very interesting display using the Smlemk111 as the front leg. I think that I have figured out the bayonet locking mechanism and the threads on the front leg are in good nick so I should be able to have a machine shop build the keeper for the Bren atachment bracket. Also if someone were to have prints of the 2 peice foreard leg I would also try to replicate that. Thanks for your help Alan in Portland Oregon

It sounds like you have a Mk1* or the intermediate version which never had the AA option. There is no extra bracket to fit to the 3rd leg, its machined into the head like this.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...62304466-1.jpg

Hi Yes that is exacktly what I have except it is missing the bit that locks the bayonet lug on the rifle to the tripod head, or the 2 peice extension onto the tripod head. I have figured out how to make the locking bit I am missing for the tripod head but the peices that I am missing and are not sure about are the two peices that go on the front leg. The one peice is threaded and holds the bracket that I am missing onto the leg. the other peice is the bracket that the Bren is locked onto for anti air craft fire. It the bit that locks the bayonet lug onto the tripod head checkerd on the end or is it smooth on the exposed end. Thanks Alan in Portland

I've taken some more photos for you.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...CIMG1255-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...CIMG1254-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...CIMG1253-1.jpg

Blimey BP!! That Tripod is in a right state! The QM will go MENTAL if he saw that!....Lol! Clean off all that rust with WIREWOOl & PLENTY of Oil. It wont take any of the paint finnish off then, You could 'patch paint' the areas lacking a paint finnish which would be better for now, rather than a total stripdown, derusting & respray! COME ON, JUMP TO IT LAD!.....................

Oh thats not rust, its patina.

Looking at and thinking about the rifle bayonet fixture to use as the third leg in an AA tripod makes me wonder about the sanity of the person who even thought about such a complicated and ludicrous idea. Ok, it worked in theory but the practice was sheer lunacy. It's a bit like putting a can or tin opener on a bayonet.............. As if any average squaddy would starve to death for want of a can or bottle opener.... I mean....., really!

And if you havent got a can opener, well.... you have a Bayonet!..............:lol: (Arent' they the same?)

Exactly Tankie! It's like the wire cutters........... It'd be cheaper to give everyone a set of good quality 'snap-on' pliers that would slip into any bit of kit he has. At least a pair of pliers is versatile, unlike those wire cutters on the scabbard

Thanks for the pictures that will make it much easier to fab up some repro parts. Just a couple of questions. With the mount at the end of the bracket open on the top does the bren lock in or does it just sort of hook into the bracket? My tripod os painted a dark flat green and it I am sure is a recent paint job is the colour of your pictured tripod the original color. Thanks Alan from Portland Oregon

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Originally Posted by smlemk111

Thanks for the pictures that will make it much easier to fab up some repro parts. Just a couple of questions. With the mount at the end of the bracket open on the top does the bren lock in or does it just sort of hook into the bracket? My tripod os painted a dark flat green and it I am sure is a recent paint job is the colour of your pictured tripod the original color. Thanks Alan from Portland Oregon

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The Bren simply Hangs on that 'Hook' as you call it. Belive it or not, gravity pulls it down as well as the firer pulling the gun into his shoulder in usage in the A role. The gun hangs from the underside front mounting pin, simple as that! So yes, it is 'Open' at the top ie: half moon if you like.

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Originally Posted by Peter Laidler

Exactly Tankie! It's like the wire cutters........... It'd be cheaper to give everyone a set of good quality 'snap-on' pliers that would slip into any bit of kit he has. At least a pair of pliers is versatile, unlike those wire cutters on the scabbard

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Pete, the trend has been for a few years now that the lads would obtain 'Leatherman Tools' at thier own expense. A Very good multi-tool with a pliers facility as well. They are usefull in the field for bodge jobs to get you out of trouble. But nothing as good a a correct tool for the job at hand. I suspect also, that a lot of the guys bought them, but they hung on the waistbelt in thier pouches. Looking 'War-ey' (Ally if your Airborne!) & saw little use!........Certainly did away with can openers, other knives, screwdrivers, spanners, etc, etc. In my opinion, usage of this tool indiscriminately would result in damage to most fixings & fasteners!

While it does 'hang' on the hook......, slightly..........., it is quite ingenious because it has to be put into the hook in a set 'past horizontal' position and as it's lowered, another little knob/lug on the butt slide prevents the gun jumping out of the hooked part.

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Originally Posted by tankhunter

Pete, the trend has been for a few years now that the lads would obtain 'Leatherman Tools' at thier own expense. A Very good multi-tool with a pliers facility as well. They are usefull in the field for bodge jobs to get you out of trouble. But nothing as good a a correct tool for the job at hand. I suspect also, that a lot of the guys bought them, but they hung on the waistbelt in thier pouches. Looking 'War-ey' (Ally if your Airborne!) & saw little use!........Certainly did away with can openers, other knives, screwdrivers, spanners, etc, etc. In my opinion, usage of this tool indiscriminately would result in damage to most fixings & fasteners!

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Canada started issuing the leatherman tool about a decade back. While it turned out to be a very useful and well liked implement, we did experience an increase in guys visiting the MIR for the first while. Turns out that the blades on these were actually razor sharp, unlike the old C1 pocket knife. Some of the guys learned too late that if you drop it with the knife portion extended, not to try and catch it.

We also had a small 'KNIFE, pocket, with locking blade' that was quite useful. It also had a can and bottle opener too. I don't think that they're issued now.

As a bit of an aside, during a discussion about a 'new' bayonet, they still insisted that it should be a multi tool too. I suggested to Lt Col Tony ------ that maybe a proper multi tool or pair of good pliers might be a better option for the Infantry. He hummed and haa'd, thought and commented that with all these things, we have to bear in mind our responsibilities with regards to health and safety etc etc in the workplace and in action. I said 'Tony, we're talking about giving them fxxxxxg BAYONETS here..............' To which we all had a chuckle

SMLE MkV as AA leg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...10/11/21-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...10/11/11-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...010/11/3-1.jpg

AA leg locking pin, missing the spring.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...010/11/4-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...010/11/7-1.jpg

I've taken a load more if you want me to email them.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...010/11/8-1.jpg

This is my Mk1* front leg, does your look like this, or is there an obvious gap?

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...10/11/61-1.jpg

This is the leg axle thingy on my mk1* and it has the hole for the AA leg locking pin, even though it was never to be used for such.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...010/11/5-1.jpg

Hi Thanks for the additional pictues. No my front leg doesnt look like your Mk1*, on my front leg from the foot end in the AA mount configuration about 3 inches from the foot it has a stop for the bracket that holds the brengun which is about 1and1/2 inches and in length then it is threaded for about 1/2 inch with a fine thread for the peice that retains the tripod bracket to the leg, the tube that the I am talking about is about 1and1/4 inches OD. My tripod didn't come with the third leg for use in the AA configuration. Please send me your pictures my email is majagun@aol.com Thanks Alan in Portland Oregon

If anyones interested in the actual mechanics of the AA part of the tripod, then look at Peregrines thread about the Monotype Mk2 and picture 3 shows the small square stud near the fromt mounting pin. This lug clears the tripod AA hook in the over horizontal mounting position but interrupts the hook when it's lowered. While the gun does hand from the hook, it is prevented from coming off (unless it's properly dismounted) by this little block of steel.

Later on, during the 60's, the factory wanted to eliminate this stud on the later Mk3 butt slides then in production because it meant MUCH unnecessary machining and expense. The MoS refused because the butt slides were a big export item and while the UK didn't need the block, other nations might have needed it and it was a part of the original design and drawings. Quite WHO might need it is a mystery. That's the only reason why I knew about this little block of steel and the reason it's on the butt slide.

There, another useless bit of Enfield knowledge for you

Those spring loaded pins and lock wheels shown on the bipod were all retained with pins. During the rebuild programmes, we didn't use the pins as they were sometimes difficult to find and remove and a waste of rations. We used split pins. But you had to smooth the split ends off to get rid of the sharp edges.

Thank you Peter for that explination of how the Bren is locked into what I call the mounting bracket in AA mode for lack of a better name. I wondered what the peice if metal next to the "hooks" purpose is and now I know, its the lock. I just couldnt understand how the Bren could sit on the "hook" with no lock and be fired without it coming off. I had never noticed the bit of metal you have pointed out.

I have the MKI* tripod, it has the extendable front leg but no provisions for mounting the gun or AA extensions. A friend of mine has said he has an extra MKI front leg with the mounting point for the gun. Is it possible to take the front leg he has and replace mine with it? By the looks of the pictures, I'd also need a new tripod head to get the AA extension mounting point?

Yep, you need a head with the machining for the SMLE or 3rd leg. Or, if you have access to one with the AA head, you can have your Mk1* machined to the same dimensions. I have seen one which has been modified this way.

Lost by an Army Officer during training for D Day in 1944 this Webley Mk4 was dug up from an old covered in slit trench in 2003. It was left in a waste oil tank for a year or so. It seemed to operate, extract and eject so was fired. All 12 bullets hit the fig.11 target at 10 yards. The broken grip shows where the digger of the new trench in 2003 hit it with his shovel

I've just been corrected that it won't have been the Officer that lost the pistol, - but his batman!

Nice one Peter. Do you think my CLLE will ever fire? I doubt it!!!!

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...CIMG1443-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...CIMG1450-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...IMG14451-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...CIMG1447-1.jpg

Anyone got a spare relic CLLE or SMLE bolt for it?

I'm tempted to mill out the tripod head on mine. Gonna sit on it for a bit and think though. If I do, I guess I better pick up an Enfield so I can use it as the third leg.

If you can mill the head, you can defo make up the AA leg.

Off the bren tripod thread for a bit, but what's the story behind the CLLE BP. Don'tsay an Officers batman lost it - again!

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Originally Posted by Peter Laidler

Off the bren tripod thread for a bit, but what's the story behind the CLLE BP. Don'tsay an Officers batman lost it - again!

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Not this time Peter, it was the Officers Batmans Batman that lost this one!

It was found at RAF No.2 Depot (Later No.2 Maintenance Unit) near Altincham, it was exposed during demolition of the hangars along with a large number of Webley MkVI service revolvers which had been buried for some reason. I can only assume that they were scrap and buried rather than actually go for scrap.

I intend to rebuild it keeping the rifle as is but fitting replacement parts to it. The barrel is completely rusted and slightly bent so no worries there. I'm hoping that SMLE parts will fit as getting hold of CLLE parts will be pretty difficult.

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Originally Posted by Brit plumber

If you can mill the head, you can defo make up the AA leg.

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I figure milling the head shouldn't be too bad. Get the dimensions should be fairly easy as I can use a bayonet to pull them from.

[QUOTE=Brit plumber;149707]Not this time Peter, it was the Officers Batmans Batman that lost this one!

It was found at RAF No.2 Depot (Later No.2 Maintenance Unit) near Altincham, it was exposed during demolition of the hangars along with a large number of Webley MkVI service revolvers which had been buried for some reason. I can only assume that they were scrap and buried rather than actually go for scrap.

I doubt they were scrap. IF they were complete, it is entirely possible they they were 'Surplus' to demands! IE: Not acounted for in the unit smallarms ledgers. It was EXTEMELY common to have 'Buckshee' smallarms during & after the War. The circumstances of weapons being moved about, lost in action Etc. It was VERY easy in those days to have almost ANY weapon you wanted! People were sick & tired of the War & anything to do with it. All they wanted was to get back home to thier families & loved ones. Burying excess & unacounted for kit was a quick & easy option! I would stick my neck out & say that ALMOST every old Wartime camp/ establishment had some 'Goodies' buried somewhere upon them! My Father recalls that the OLD Armourers shop at S.E.M.E (Havanah Barracks, Now Prince PHillip Barrack) that when HE ran that shop as Unit Armourer Sgt. He burried 'Quite a lot' of Buckshee Enfiled No.4's, Revolvers & a .50" Cal HMG under the floor foundations when they concreted it after the war! I was present there during my upgraders course many years later When that shop was demolished. It was indeed true, & I kept in touch with the civvy foreman who oversaw the demolition job. He had no choice but to declare all these weapons & they were subsequently taken away & cut up for scrap. they were rusted, But Im sure that after a LOT of cleaning up. They would have functioned. He also informed me about a HUGE amount of Brens, stens Etc that were buried around the surounding woods in Bordon Garrison that he had a bulldozer dig a trench & lay the lot out in a line & recovered over. I obviously have quized him as to where about they were entombed. But he tells me it was so many years ago, he cannot remember! these were all left behind by the Canadian army in Martineique Barracks in the attics & lofts of the old victorian buildings. Along with 'spare' Jeep tyres & other sundry MT spares. Just go's to show, what can be discovered!

hi does anyone have the production numbers for the various producers of bren tripods esp the Canadian ones?
thanks yukoner

On this vague note if anyone needs a make a part for the folding Mk II* tripod I copied the set of D.D.(E.)s at the Pattern Room Library back when it was still MoD. Wish I'd done the Mk I and II now.

Also got the drawings for the Indian version of the folding papa tripod.

ATB

Tom

These are the pictures I was looking for to see the how the AA leg looks and it mounts to the Tripod . Anyone have the AA post for sale .Please contact me.

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Thanks... :cheers:

Regards,
Doug

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Originally Posted by tr63

Anyone have the AA post for sale .Please contact me.

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Should post in the WTB. The last post in this thread is five years old.