Hello,
I've just bought an M1 carbine BASIC FIELD MANUAL FM23-7 in french.
I did not know that the American war office had printed such documents.
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Hello,
I've just bought an M1 carbine BASIC FIELD MANUAL FM23-7 in french.
I did not know that the American war office had printed such documents.
There was also one done for the M1 Garand ... I saw a copy of this once, wished I had the money at that time to purchase it
Patrick
I'll bet it's been dropped. :surrender:
As you have a member here from France posting this type of stuff can offend him and make him think all people think here in the US is France Surrenders at will.
Maybe you will remember these men when you post this type of stuff
August 19,2008
2 platoons, 60 men, belonging to the 8ème Régiment de Parachutistes d'Infanterie de Marine (Airborne ... Marine Infantry) 2ème Régiment Etranger de Parachutistes (Airborne ... Foreign Legion) and Régiment de Marche du Tchad (Motorised Infantry ... Marine Infantry) patrolling with an unit of the Afghan National Army, 30 miles of Kabul, near Surobi have been caught in an important ambush at the end of the afternoon.
Many IED and RPGs hit the patrol, the fight went late into the night until mid morning, 10 French soldiers have been killed in action and 21 wounded.
Circumstances of the ambush: A group of 100 French, ANA and US SF were ending a patrol at high altitude and making a RECO on foot, no UAV available, when a group of 100 Talibans opened fire. 8 French paratroopers of the 8th RPIMA and one medic of the 2nd REP were instantly killed, a dozen of soldiers including the CO were wounded. Firefight last for hours during the night until morning, fire support came from two Apache and two A10 and partly from two Caracal used for MEDEVAC.
30 Talibans killed (their leader presumably among them), 30 Talibans wounded according to available informations.
Looks like the Talebans have really taken an agressive stance for weeks. An american unit had to go through a fierce fight near the border with Pakistan during the night.
Today France mourns it's Heros
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...aV2zxmN9-1.jpg
God Bless these fallen soldiers
From the 8ème Régiment de Parachutistes d'Infanterie de Marine
Sergent-chef DEVEZ Sébastien
Caporal-chef BUIL Damien
Caporal-chef GREGOIRE Nicolas
1ère classe CHASSAING Kevin
1ère classe GAILLET Damien
1ère classe LEPAHUN Julien
1ère classe RIVIERE Anthony
1ère classe TAANI Alexis
From the 2ème Régiment Etranger de Parachutistes
CCH PENON
From the Régiment de Marche du Tchad
Pvt Melam Baouma
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...3/PqYWXS-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../aV29dwr-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../aV5LQqJ-1.jpg
Not a single one of the men SURRENDERED ... they DIED for their country and Nation along side men from the United States and other countries fighting the War on Terrorism
You have come to a new board where I know that the moderators of this board will not tolerate, put up with this type of language or discrimination as many of them are from Canada, with some of them having French backgrounds in their blood and are proud of it.
Patrick
Sont ils l'appelant un boîte de culasse ou bloc de culasse ?
J'aimerais voir le livre entier
Patrick
Patrick, i will try to scan all the book. But it won't be easy as it is in a verry good state and i don't want to damage it. The receiver is called "Boîte de culasse" in the french manual.
Cafdfw, yes the carbine was air dropped, I already talk about it's story in the old forum.
Vous remercier... J'étais juste curieux s'ils avaient changé la nomenclature, qu'ils semblent ne pas avoir fait si. Si vous décidez de scruter le livre, je serais intéressé dans une copie, tout vous pouvez dire probablement que je recueille des armes à feu françaises et bourre.
Patrick
Sheesh one of my best friends is French and we joke about things. Guess he's not so thin skinned. My apologies.
As we have many different members from many different countries on this forum with a few from France itself and I for one respect the French military and its weaponary, All I want is this forum to be kept civil, talk about French weapons not politics, hatred or anything else. Comments towards the French government, people, soldiers, or weapons such as Used Once and Dropped, pieces of junk, French troops were cowards, White Flag and surrendering, French government and people are ____ etc., etc. only makes things harder to learn about the weapons we all love to collect and shoot.
I would just hate to see the forums here turning into a free for all on bashing stuff when we can concentrate on other things we enjoy. I hope you can understand my point on this.
I would also like to say THANK YOU for the apology and now we can get back to the point we are both here ... talk fireams and learn from one another.
Thanks
Patrick
Mlr224,
That manual may have been translated by French personnel, the use of the name Mousqueton being typically French.
In 1943, some of the units of the French army operating out of North Africa were equipped with US hardware, and the need for written instructions in French must have led to the translation of many US manuals.
Patrick, thanks for the reminder.
Cafdfw, I also happen to own a dropped M1 carbine, a Saginaw SG that was air delivered to the French resistance in Brittany during the winter 1943/44, my wife grandad made good use of it at the time.
Patrick: My high school French is sadly outdated. Would you kindly interpret both either here or with a PM on the above?
Merci mon ami,
Greg O
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1886lebel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg O
Greg,
It says something like:
"Thank you… I was just curious to know if they had changed the nomenclature, which they apparently did not do. If you decide to look at the book, I would be interested in a copy, you probably can tell that I collect french firearms and munitions"
Quote:
Originally Posted by cafdfw
Cafdfw,
It's " if you decide to scan the book, I would be interested in a copy".
kelt
I have owned a French MAAS for a few years now, I doubt it was ever dropped by anyone. I have the rifle, sling, cartridge pouches, a cleaning kit, a grenade launcher, and bayonette and scabbard. I think the rifle shoots just as well as anything else I own, and I like it. While the French soldiers were betrayed by their leaders in WW2 I think they went through terrible things during that period heroically, as well as in IndoChina and later, as described above. I remember the Frenchmen who shared our training facilities at Lowry AFB in the early 50s, they were great people and we got along well with them. They were as proud of their country as we were of ours.Quote:
Originally Posted by kelt
Anybody can be overcome by overwhelming odds, it does not make them cowards. My opinion, anyway. Ken
Thank you...
Yeah my language skills are definitely toast...:bow:
Quote:
Originally Posted by cafdfw
Greg,
I can't take the credit on this one. I can translate German fairly well but only know a little French.
I was curious what it said too and sent the link to this thread to my friend in France and he translated it for me. He laughed at me for getting bashed here. :bitch:
I will make an occasional joke about the French. But remember, if it wasn't for the aid of the French during the American Revolution, we would probably still be under British rule. And we all know what the British gun laws are.
I've seen US radio manuals printed in French as well.
The French got a lot of US WW2 equipment in the years just after the war.
Comments on the internet have a bit wider an audience than a single friend.Quote:
Originally Posted by cafdfw
OT well myself i'd like to thank the french.they had built a good size fort at Dong Ha.Well made concrete pill boxes and bunkers.as a member of the TRC-27 section, i spent many nights in a old pillbox where we had shots to Con Thien and Cua Viet.Just something more secure about concrete verses sandbags. Semper Fi Al
Hello,
For those who are interested here is a link towards the first part of FM23-7 in French in PDF.
http://tirmontbeliard.free.fr/docume...ench_part1.pdf
I also have a few French Rifles, bought about 10-12 years ago.
Have a few friends who when they see them they must utter a cuss word. I will have to admit that they are kinda ugly.
But, each and every one of them have TRIPLED in value since I bought them. Guess someone likes them.
1886lebel,
I see your point, but then you write replys in French, which others can not read. Which is an insult also.
"...this type of stuff can offend him..." 1886lebel, I'm not French, but it's offensive just the same.
cafdfw, learn some history. Find some non-American history about W.W. II. The French 2nd Armoured Div.(General LeClerc's story alone will open your eyes) and the French Resistance(Chuck Yeager was saved by them) would be a place to start.
mlr224, it's most likely a Lend/Lease manual. Mind if I ask what you paid for it? Just curious.
Sunray, I paid it 15 euro or approximately 20 USD at an old books trader in Paris.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimF4M1s
Sunray, maplebacon, et al, I apologized at the beginning. I didn't want to respond to the continued insults, but I understand that I provided a situation for some people to make themselves feel better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunray
- It's apparent the situation has become a forum for some people to exercise their self righteousness; commenting repeatedly after my apology at the beginning. I GET IT, OK?
Sunray, (FWIW), I minored in Modern History; mostly the years of WWI – WWII – Korean ‘Conflict’-and on. I was interested in German activities leading up to WWII from the Weimar Republic to the takeover of the government by Hitler's Nazi party who destroyed the system of democracy of the Weimar Republic, which was very similar to our own system. One of the main reasons the Weimar Republic failed was the horrible economy at the time it was in place. Germany was hit harder by the Great Depression than any other nation because had many repayments etc from its defeat in WWII. The people were literally starving and fell for Hitler's promises and he took over. The economy actually did improve after he took over and the people really blindly got behind him.
* There are many similarities of what is going on in our own Government today. Many and I'm not being paranoid. As far as I will go with this, but the similarities of the details is so much like things going on presently, including gun registration and harsh enforcements. God, now he's proposing a 'National Police' - Brownshirts then the Schultz Staffel that started as Hitler's personal police unit, but grew to what it became later.
I often wonder if these classes are available to college students now.
My niece graduated with honors in 'Communications'. She went to a movie with me and afterward she asked questions about what lead up to Vietnam. I explained a very short rundown about Vietnam and the politics involved and she said they didn't have any references to the war years of modern times. She knew NOTHING about Vietnam, WWI, WWII and thought Germany and Japan were our allies because we do so much trade with them now. (Honest to God truth!)
As it says, "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it".
My niece voted for Obama just because she wanted 'change' as many other college students did who don't have a clue.
Sorry for the long post and getting off topic.
I contribute to the French unit of the Commemorative Air Force. They only have two small observation aircraft, but the unit has more spirit than most units I've visited in the US. I've written a few articles about the history of the CAF for them that have been used in their newsletter. I also send many current photos of local events. I'm in regular contact with members there and report flying activities in the US. I’ve met them each year as they visit my Unit and then a week later at the annual CAF 'AIRSHO'
I don't hate anyone. The French people I know are wonderful and very patriotic.
As I said before, please forgive me for using the old common joke. It meant no offense at all.
~ Harlan
0311Shooter,Quote:
Originally Posted by 0311Shooter
I don't think I've seen many of the French Rifles from WWII. If I've seen them I didn't know what they were.
Would you mind posting some photos of what you have? They sound interesting.
Thanks,
~ Harlan
I messed up one thing in my post with a typo. I should have written 'WWI"
-- One of the main reasons the Weimar Republic failed was the horrible economy at the time it was in place. Germany was hit harder by the Great Depression than any other nation because they had many repayments etc from its defeat in WWI. During the great depression German citizens were having to do anything for food. Inflation was unreal. Citizens had to literally take wheel-barrows of printed marks to buy a loaf of bread. The country was so poor it only printed money on one side of bills.
The Versailles treaty ruined Germany, but it was never really enforced by the nations that imposed it. The people were literally starving and fell for Hitler's promises and he took over. Hitler knew the Versailles treaty was unfair and he ignored the sanctions imposed and he began building a military force. The world did nothing to stop him. Chamberlain visited Germany just before Hitler invaded Poland and he saw the military buildup and aircraft but he was afraid and signed more worthless treaties thinking he had appeased Hitler. When Hitler defeated France he made them sign surrender documents in the same boxcar the WWI Versailles treaty was signed as a hateful gesture to the French.
The economy actually did improve after he took over and the people blindly got behind him. We've all seen the huge blind (strange) demonstrations that took place in the early years.
the French received a large amount of US war aid in the latter part of WW II.
In late 1944 the French had four divisions on the Western Front -- they occupied the line just north of Switzerland. In January 1945 the Germans staged an attack near Strasbourg (Lorraine, IIRC) and various guys at SHAEF were thinking of withdrawing and leaving the French citizens of that town (liberated some 2 months before) to the tender mercies of the SS and Gestapo. De Gaulle went nuts and told Ike that if the US Army tried to withdraw at least his French forces would stay and try to protect the city. Ike vetoed the plans and American and French forces fought off the German attack short of Strasbourg.
IIRC the US gave the French about a quarter-million rifles, mainly Models of 1917 and 1903 (probably A3). They probably sent them a certain number of M-1 carbines as well.
Since the late 19th Century the French term "carabine" was usually used for a shortened version of a full-size, full power rifle -- hence Carabine Mdl of 1892 (IIRC). Since the M-1 Carbine had no parts in common with the M-1 Rifle the use of the term "carabine" would have been confusing (IMHO) to French supply and ordnance officers. I suspect they called the M-1 the "Fusil M-1" and Mosqueton was a term for a shortened, lightened rifle -- appropriate for the US M-1 Carbine.
I never had any problem with Free French Forces during WWII. They were active in most theaters of operations and performed admirably. They did quite well during our own revolution and There wasn't much to criticize about their performance during WWI either. Unfortunately, during the beginning of WWII, it was their leadership who let them down, not the soldiery. Poor tactics was the problem, not the willingness to fight or the courage of the individual.
Harlan's responses were very appropriate.
Some of us, myself included, tend to let the fingers get ahead of the brain while trying to beat the "automatic time-out" here.
Being able to read the "true intent" of a post is imperative to true understanding of someone's post.