Mauser 71/84

I've been offered an M71/84 which I don't know a lot about. The metal and bore look good but the stock looks too nice and the cartouches don't look quite right. $700 is the asking price. Photos below are what I have on it now. I will be able to inspect in person.

I don't know enough about the cartouches on these to know what these are but they do not match any known examples I've been able to compare them too.

What can the experts tell me?

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...off8mgt1-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ruheager-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...jzkzrqav-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...amek27gl-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...76ohixhf-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ejnkczxy-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...jqvhjorc-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...yc93z8ko-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...1x8smy3w-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...aklrszhj-1.jpg

There's a nice example piece in the MKL with a 125 pic photo montage to compare to... ;)

1887 I.G. (Infanterie-Gewehr) Model 71/84 (11mm) Mauser

Regards,
Doug

Thanks Doug, that one looks better than this one. My main concern is the stock markings. They don't look real to me but that may simply be because I've never seen any just like them before.

"They don't look real to me but that may simply be because I've never seen any just like them before."

Your feeling is quite correct. IMHO, the stock is a replacement ( the wood looks "too new to be true") and the markings are faked. And not even good fakes. M / 71 and 71/84 inspection stamps (Revisionsstempel) always used German black-letter ("Gothic") script. As can be seen on the photo of the knoxform (knocksform? nocksform?) left and right of the "FW" stamp that indicated the monarch/state. And the stamp for the monarch did not appear on the stock at all. So the FW on the butt can only be a fake, regardless of styling. In other words, the faker didn't have a clue what he was doing. And thereby spoilt a good-looking (but not original) stock.

The official marking plan was like this:

Unfortunately, the software doesn't seem to like Windows 8.1. I cannot insert pics anymore, and just get small-sized attachments. Does anyone else have the same problem - and maybe a solution?

So you think the stock is a modern reproduction or an older replacement? The cartouches just look cartoonish to me, I just didn't want to come out and say that. In any case, I assume this is not worth anywhere near $700 with this new information?

Ouch!! wouldn't want to be you in this negotiation Aragorn, he ain't gonna like what you have to say...:bash:

"So you think the stock is a modern reproduction or an older replacement?"


A service replacement stock would also have had the correct markings. And that wood does not look 130 years old! More like 13! Or even 3! It is a modern stock. And I do not even think it is the correct species of wood (juglans regia), the typical source being Caucasian walnut. I have never seen an original 19th C. military stock with walnut as pale as that one - if it is even juglans regia.

Thanks Patrick, you saved me a lot of grief. I just had a bad feeling about it.

Warpig, I suspect he knows or did it himself. He sent me the photos and very specifically asked twice what I thought. I haven't set up a meeting time with him yet and had told him I didn't have that kind of money for THIS right now as I'm seeking a GEW 98. He was willing to hold it a month for me so I could come up with the cash. I'll just graciously decline a meeting. I may say the stock and markings are causing me some concerns and let it at that.

Remember if your gut tells you something believe it. better to wait than get burned or sick over a mistake

Take a slow look at the photo of the muzzle and nosecap.

Note that the nose cap has a different number to the rest of the barrelled system.

Note that the wood between nosecap and barrel is split, and a piece is missing.

Conclusion: a replacement nosecap was force-fitted to the replacement stock.

The only positive aspects that I can observe for this rifle are that the system looks good (for its age) and the rifling is clearly visible right up to the muzzle. It may prove to be a good shooter.
But from the collector's point of view: forget it.


"Remember if your gut tells you something believe it." - That so-called "gut feeling" is often the result of having subconsciously observed something that jars, without being consciously aware (yet) of just exactly what it is.

I sent him a e-mail this morning. Tried to be tactful:

"I'm going to pass on the rifle. I had some concerns with the stock markings as they are different than any I've seen. I showed the photos to an expert on these rifles and he concluded that the stock is a replacement stock of some sort and not original to the rifle. The markings are inconsistent with any known German examples.

The rifle would be great to a shooter but not so much to a collector and I'm not a shooter.

Thanks for the offer though it is nice seeing these old warhorses."

If I get an "interesting" reply, I'll let you know.

I did get a reply. He says his "expert" told him they marked the stocks that way when they had the magazine added. But maybe my expert is better than his expert.