30-03 converted to 30-06

I have a SA173767 rifle converted to 30-06 I believe, fitted with a no pin stock, concurrent with the period of conversion. It has what I believe is a period sling. (BTW, how would one describe such a rifle? rebuilt? remanufactured? Surely not a mixmaster?)
It is in very nice shape, the only defect is a nicely repaired stock crack (a reason for 2 pins?).
What should I look for to get further information on the possible history of this rifle. I have had my ankle replaced and will have some time available for a bit.

Cheers
Warren

Warren, please post some pictures of your rifle.

Hi Fred:

Promise not to laugh, but I couldn,t find the key to my display cabinet when I went to look at it. (really good security) I hadn't been in there since I had to quit going to the range because my ankle gave out.
But I will find it or get it picked. The other rifles I would also like to photograph for the record.

Cheers
Warren

The rifle would be called a rebuild. Sounds like an honest rifle, the kind we all like to shoot. Yes, get skippy and drill that lock out...so we can see... Then lots of clear close pics.

Hi Jim:

Don't know about shooting it considering the controversy about the low numbered Springfields. But I bought it because it encapsulated so much history:
Probably paid too much for it, but I would say it is pretty rare. Probably more so than my Mark I.

Cheers
Warren

Now I see, a 1XX XXX series, I thought it was higher for some reason. Yes, a 30-03 rebuild would be very early numbered at that. Still we'll be looking forward to pics.

While technically a "rebuild", such rifles you see today in this condition in most cases remained that after their overhaul in 1906-1910 and are considered "original". Obviously, not near the value had the rifle remained in 30-03, but still a very valuable piece of merchandise!!

Pictures, please!!

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

Now I see, a 1XX XXX series, I thought it was higher for some reason

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Thanks for the interest guys: The first thing I had better do is to confirm I copied the number on the rifle into my data base correctly!! Then see what kind of a photographer I am.

Cheers
Warren(13)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by whturner13

confirm I copied the number on the rifle into my data base correctly

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Not your fault. I read it quickly and incorrectly... Love to see it when time comes.

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Originally Posted by Fred G.

Warren, please post some pictures of your rifle.

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OK I am struggling with it though.

[img]https://www.milsurps.com/vbpgimage.php?dohttps://www.milsurps.com/vbpgimage.php?

do=full&p=3220&d=1474748876=full&p=3219&d=1474746361[/img]

If you can't manage, them PM me and I'll give you and Email to send me pics, I'll post them...

I will take you up on that, while I try to learn it myself. I have a few ( 4 to be exact) in my Gallery but It seemed like more luck than purpose.

I have done a superficial inspection of the rifle and compared it with the references I have, and my tentative conclusion is that:
1) The stock and hardware are early, but not rod bayonet early.
2) The rifle itself appears to be original, except for the parts associated with the conversion.
3) The Barrel is 1908 (right in the middle of the conversion years)
4) The sling is old enough it could be "original", but who knows)
There is a bunch of stuff an expert in Springfield 03 -0x might be interested in, I would like to know about, and maybe help out, assuming it is "original"
Again thanks for the offer.
Did you take a look at the 4 Pics I did get online?

Cheers
Warren

I did, the look good...check inbox for PM... Your sling is original for age, but I'd never suggest it was original to THAT rifle...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

I did, the look good...check inbox for PM... Your sling is original for age, but I'd never suggest it was original to THAT rifle...

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I suspect that applies to the marriage between the stock and the rifle also: hard to imagine they carefully preserved data on the stock after removal so that it returned to the same specific receiver/new-bbl. Unlike the Brits, who stamp serial numbers on both rifle and stock.

Cheers
Warren

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fred G.

Warren, please post some pictures of your rifle.

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See my Gallery - a few posted - more to come.

I could not see any of the images - I'd suggest emailing them to one of us and letting us post them.

The 1906-1910 rifles as I said earlier, I do not regard as TRUE "rebuilds" - I call them "rebuilt to their original form", which I realize doesn't make a whole lot of sense. They are among my favorite M1903s - I've had 3-4 of them.

The best guide to this type rifle was a small book written by C.S. Ferris and John Beard a number of years ago, which I sincerely wish could get updated and reprinted. Unfortunately, the used copies run anywhere from $100+ to over $600.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...standard-1.jpg

Agreed, I looked at your gallery and there's still four, unless they take time to manifest. We'll help if you like. Myself or Rick...

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Originally Posted by Rick the Librarian

They are among my favorite M1903s

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I agree, they resemble an art...

From what I can see, definitely one of the 1906-10 overhaul rifles. Like to see more! :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rick the Librarian

From what I can see, definitely one of the 1906-10 overhaul rifles. Like to see more! :)

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I thank you and Jim for the offer - the pics were an experiment to see how good my photo skills were: the little Canon Point and shoot
seems to work just fine. Won't have to get out my Olympus OMs, lenses, and paraphernalia.
I will have to work on the lighting, the color rendition is dreadful except for the rifle overview shot.
Another problem is shrinking the size to upload requirements. My shot of the Butt Plate and Oiler had had the entire oiler in the photo, but even though the number of bits were OK, part of the photo was cut off.

If you and Jim have any specific parts of the rifle you would like pictured in detail, I will shoot them while I am at it.

Rick - I was reading the Ferris and Beard publication as I was working on this project. Kind of amusing, because one of the things I wanted to get for this rifle was some estimate of value for my collection of militaria. Instead, maybe I need to inventory my books also.

Cheers
Warren

Mine is close to your rifle being serial number 160963 with a SA 2-07 dated barrel and also a no bolt stock with the CCV cartouche but with a non serif P roof in a circle. I have seen three or four during the past few years with the CCV cartouche. Sock channel should be inletted to fit the early open bottom rear sight base

Other than yours being earlier (Serial no. and Barrel date -mine 1-08) the only difference I see is that I cannot find any proof mark. Why?

Cheers
Warren

You mean just aft of the trigger guard? Is there ANYTHING there like an eagle's head or number?

Because of an earlier thread discussing wrench marks on rebuild rifle M1903 I examined two of my rifles and in the process took a lot of images, which since neither had any wrench marks I thought more appropriate to share some of the images here.

Both of these rifles were not only conversions from .30-03 to .30-06 they also went through rebuild later. The first two images are of SN 68484 showing the receiver and barrel markings. The rear sight base was apparently replaced in a later rebuild as it is solid.

The third image compares the various inspector markings on the bottom of the receivers, SN 68484 on the left and SN 255576 on the right.

The next three images are of SN 255576 receiver, barrel, and rear sight base, which shows the original groove for the rear sight base pin before rebuild visible near the forward opening in the base. The Hatcher gas port was drilled during later rebuild.

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Originally Posted by Rick the Librarian

You mean just aft of the trigger guard? Is there ANYTHING there like an eagle's head or number?

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There is a very small "D" or maybe it is a stylized "A", and some kind of symbol I do not recognize. But not a circle P. I have a pretty good picture of the stock in that area, as well as 3 of the ends of the dowels used in the repair of the stock crack.
If you can see my gallery it is one of the 4 test photos. I can also send you (and Jim) an email attachment. Or maybe, once I get ino some research, I will find out that it is well known, just not by me.

Cheers
Warren

Send things along and we'll post them. Then we can sort things out here...pics are worth lots.

Here are some more pics of whturner13's rifle...

Looks like a ram rod bayonet 1903 stacking swivel too

According to Ferris and Beard somewhere around 1905 to 1906 the solid shaft stacking and lower band solid swivels were replaced by split shaft swivels. Haven't taken a picture yet, but both swivels have solid shanks.

Cheers
Warren

I should have said that is a ram rod bayonet stacking swivel as one end is milled flat and not the sling swivel

WT ...

You mentioned in an earlier post that there was no proof mark on the rifle. The script-style "circled P" aft of the trigger guard is the proof mark - it shows that the rifle successfully passed a [p]roof firing test before the rifle was accepted by the Army.

Nice example!

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Originally Posted by Rick the Librarian

. The script-style "circled P" aft of the trigger guard

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Love those older marks, very artistic...

Wow! I would never have deciphered that as a "P" if I hadn't been told. BTW, what insurance estimate should I place on this rifle. (I am starting on an inventory for my home insurance - I have no intention of selling anything) I kind of got distracted by the history.

Probably somewhere in the $1500-2000 range.