Wearing of mask is actually frustrating .
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Wearing of mask is actually frustrating .
You imagine having to wear one for a whole 12 hour shift in hospitals currently!
Scars on staff faces caused by the masks and sweating that will take time to heal
When I serve at the vaccination centre, 8 hours with the mask are worse than the pain in the back. That says it all…
I wonder what her husbands thoughts on vaccination are now ....?Quote:
Originally Posted by oldpaul
It's just depressing, I don't personally know anyone who has refused the vaccine, or at least admitted it....
There are plenty around my "neck of the woods." A couple of near-by counties have percentage vaccinated rates in the low 30's and 40's. Most large vaccination centers are now beginning to close. - BobQuote:
Originally Posted by mrclark303
Today, in the morning, I received an SMS from the ministry of health. There was a long code and a link to the site of the ministry.
In 1 minute I could download my Covid green pass. As a QR-code and as a printable pdf in Italian, English and German language.
I was almost moved… We Italians are used to always fight it out with public offices. Never a simple, trouble-free procedure.
I just can’t believe it was that easy.
Tomorrow, when I’ll wake up, I’ll check to see if I dreamed…
Maybe you got your bribe in earlier than everyone else?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovidio
They are ramping up the fear again. Variant D, the Indian one I believe is now going to kill us all. Or if it fails, it will develop into one that will.
Not sure who's coming up with this one but it has even the conservative guys talking about it. Meanwhile, the left is now openly admitting to everything they mocked for a year when Trump said it.
No need to bribe anybody. We are quite a different country than many imagine outside.
It’s just that the public employee unions think the jobs are there for those who fill the positions and not for the public, aka citizens.
So we often have such bad service, that we’re pleasantly surprised when things go the right way.
Here, in the North East, things go in a very good way at local level, but that “green pass” is a state thing, that’s why I was surprised.
By the way, I checked today. It is real:beerchug:
Today, I helped at the vaccination centre from 7:15 to 13:15. A friend of mine covered me until 14:00, because I had to go do the RO at our small arms range. With the heat we have right now, I am ending the day on a fairly low note, though I liked every moment of it.
Almost every moment…
Talking to my wife, I came to know a few things I had been feeling, but not really realising.
What did this frigging pandemics do to teenagers?
I live in a town of 15015 people. Fairly big and scarcely populated. My “hamlet”, a portion of the town, is less than 1000 people all in.
Among the friends and/or classmates of my 15 years daughter (I’ve got another boy, 18 and another girl, 11) there are two girls who turned anorexic. One, athlete of the year in 2019 for gymnastics, is so bad, that she refuses also water and is being forcibly fed and hydrated.
The other one has been treated and is trying to get out of it, but is literally “transparent” right now. A third one, just seized and refuses to see people, to wash, to interact… We know them all. I feel so bad about them.
Lots of kids find it terribly difficult to get out of home again.
The suicides have increased a lot too, although no official stats are released.
I must admit that I’m horrendously worried now, hearing about possible new lockdowns because of that damned delta variant.
Does it make any sense to kill the new, emerging generation to save older people, among whom I include myself?
I don’t think so.
I don’t want to accept any further lockdown for my kids…
Am I ready to fight for it?
Maybe… I am starting to think about it…
I never felt so…uncertain. So much like standing on unstable ground…
Do you hear anything like this over there, where you are?
USA, Yes. - BobQuote:
Originally Posted by Ovidio
Things like this could have been avoided by doing the opposite of what was done. E.g. only quarantine sick people, not healthy ones. Keeping everything open. Not forcing healthy people to wear a mask hiding their faces.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovidio
Asking old and vulnerable people to take care and extra precautions.
Over here there are many rumbling noises being made against government but with this covid thing perhaps only being another nail in the coffin. Many things here have been turned into a FUBAR state in the last twenty five years and people across all groups are pretty much fed up. Promises were made to the masses and not kept while the money was.
My same opinion…
Problem is, modern western people are scared of living, because they might die as a consequence of it…
I've pretty much said it from the start. These lockdowns never should have happened. Anecdotal stories of some young person dying here or there are frankly meaningless. People die all the time from obscure things. This is a disease that affects the elderly. The average death in the US is 78 which is also our life expectancy. Yet even the elderly have a 94% survival rate. Almost no one under the age of 60 is dying from this and under the age of 20, it's an effective rate of zero. Suicides are way up among the young, attempts are way up and this was back when it had just started. They are hiding these numbers in the US by not breaking it down by age. Oddly enough, suicides among the general population are down and this is what they are reporting. Older people for whatever reason aren't killing themselves during this in the numbers they usually do. And what really frosts me is they knew this almost from the start. Washington State where this started here had nearly all their deaths in retirement homes yet we had 5 governors order covid patients returned to their retirement homes instead of keeping them in isolation which created the massive numbers of early deaths in NY, NJ, MI and PA. CA was somehow spared the early deaths, they caught up later.
Hate to say it but it's something people need to understand. The seasonal flu is MUCH more deadly than Covid for anyone under the age of 60 and we never shut down things for the flu. They don't report the ages of those dying, they don't report it doesn't affect children, they don't report that 95% of all deaths were people that were already dying from something else. They were reporting motorcycle accident deaths as covid deaths here because they tested positive for Covid. It's ridiculous.
And yes, there are a lot of people scared of living because they believe they will die if they do. We do a lot of polling here, it's a constant aggravation but 40% of Democrats believed they would die if they got Covid and this was in November of last year, well into the pandemic when a lot was known about it. 20% of Republicans held the same belief which is still incredibly high considering this has a survival rate of 99.9%.
So today, very few are wearing masks anywhere and I know a very high percentage of anyone under 40 has not been vaccinated. The elderly are vaccinated in the high 90's now. New cases are down, deaths are way down, restrictions are gone. We essentially have acheived herd immunity yet they aren't talking about it. They are STILL pushing the vaccines and have approved them down to 12 years old now.
Boys are developing heart problems, Girls are developing fertility problems, that was predicted by one of the lead scientists at the very beginning, the boys heart issues are a new surprise however. So they are pushing an experimental vaccine on kids that are at zero risk and creating other health problems with many of them. The numbers are small but they would be zero without the vaccine.
And they keep pushing the commercials, the vaccines are fully tested, no steps were skipped, they are as safe as many prescription medications. The truth is they were never fully tested and steps were skipped. It takes about four years for a drug or vaccine to be approved and that's because they study long term effects as well as everything else. That obviously hasn't been done and it was skipped. As for being as safe as other medications, ever look at the potential side effects of aspirin or tylenol? We are the long term study. I hope that two years from now we are not suddenly afflicted by a slew of new aliments.
My wife and I were vaccinated, my oldest daughter and husband were vaccinated. My youngest daughter and husband have not been and have no intentions of doing so, they feel the risks of the vaccine are higher than the risks of Covid for them and I agree, they're in their mid twenties and planning to have kids.
Most of the elderly I know and spoke to including my own parents weren't worried about it at all. They also didn't want the younger generation to be crippled by something that didn't affect them and were willing to sacrifice themselves for them. But I live in a fairly rural type area, most of my friends and family are from the same areas. Rural areas are quite different than urban areas in almost everything. That's where the greatest fear has been cultivated and maintained.
I have found that same city vs rural situation.
And at the moment here in SA it is our flu season. Here and there people have been asking questions about people that have gone for the shot, afterwards contracting covid, and then dying. Nothing official but people have noticed and asked. Now for the question. How clever is it to get a shot that will lower your immunity for a couple of weeks in the middle of flu season while people around you are sick.
I will always remember my son saying, who is an Army Medic with lots of experience fighting Ebola in Sierra Leonne, when Astra Zenica were blamed for all the blood clots following the first injections which were 1 in 20 million at the time. He said Dad we had 8,000 blood clots in England alone every month long before the pandemic came.
If people just took the time to see the risks associated with what they used to take on a daily basis before the pandemic such as Aspirin or Hay Fever tablets and the risks associated with those giving blood clots, they wouldnt be so quick to criticise!!!
Has to be political.....as I don;t seem to see anyone giving the blood clot stats for Moderna or Phzeiser and the deaths they might have caused :madsmile:
The deaths of young educated teens is worrying, and on one hand I'm thinking this is just a flu virus, but then you look at India and other places that have been hit so so hard and lost millions. They will never really know the exact deaths because as soon as they die, they are buried or burnt, where the rules are totally different to us in the west with Coroners courts etc.
Sad times indeed and lets hope we all recover to a Status Quo level of life. Most of us have had a good life, these kids deserve so much more, just can't keep wondering what we can do for them!!
I fear that what we’ll do for them is to close them in again…
Kill’em to protect ‘em. Weirdest thing ever.
If something like a new lock down should happen, I’ll keep breaking the rules as I did since May last year. I won’t let my kids be isolated. Not the same as being free, but still some social life.
Our states mask mandate ended at midnight last night. At the same the the WHO wants everyone to mask up again due to the Indian variant. While there are some threats of shutting down again, I don't think people will accept it this time around.
For some reason we, the Brits, are being blamed for the Indian Variant circulating.
The answer is in the name, it came from India Angela Merkel.............its no good asking ALL European countries to ban ALL Brits, we all have travels in and out of India!!!
Yet another "We'll get you back for pulling out of the European Union" Its NEVER been a Union.
The richest countries keep the poorest going!!
No Politics intended, so don't start any :madsmile:
I wonder if science can grasp that this is nature, and you can't control nature. Once they open their hands and let go, let it run course, it'll be done. In nature the weak and old die. Science will keep this thing running for years.
Science and politics.Quote:
Originally Posted by browningautorifle
And money, there's money to be made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSW2
"In these Sentiments, Sir, I agree to this Constitution, with all its Faults, if they are such; because I think a General Government necessary for us, and there is no Form of Government but what may be a Blessing to the People if well administered; and I believe farther that this is likely to be well administered for a Course of Years, and can only end in Despotism as other Forms have done before it, when the People shall become so corrupted as to need Despotic Government, being incapable of any other. "Quote:
Originally Posted by browningautorifle
https://www.pbs.org/benfranklin/pop_finalspeech.html
Masks came off yesterday in our area and I was out having a look. Today also seeing many moving around still in the outdoors with masks and when I went to my favorite militaria shop, he and I were the only ones out of ten or so without masks. With all the bitchin' and pi$$in' and moanin' I'd have thought they would all be naked today. I expect there'll be people still wearing masks a year down the road. Just to be SUPER safe...
I still see people around here driving alone in their cars...wearing masks.Quote:
Originally Posted by browningautorifle
I know there's lots that can't think for themselves so unless they're forced to remove the way they were forced to wear...they'll have trouble doing it. Either way I don't care, just don't involve me. I'm not interested.
Like wearing a condom when you are on a solo mission.Quote:
Originally Posted by browningautorifle
I've become rather immune to the masks. What can you do really? I see them, a small part of my brain identifies them as a complete moron and then moves on. My wife who is a much better person than I would say they may have an immune issue or something else. The counter of course is the masks do nothing for the wearer and that's been said from day one. So who are the protecting by wearing it which leads to my second response, maybe they are sick with something which is one reason the liberals made everyone wear the masks in the first place. So the sick wouldn't be stoned in the street.
I was sitting outside a grocery store the other day and about one in ten was still wearing a mask outdoors. Even when we were required to wear them indoors, I had mine off the instant I was out the door. The majority were older women, 40's+ but there were a few men. Not one of them had any qualms about jumping in their vehicle and driving home in it despite being at about 10,000 times more at risk of death for the short ride home in the car than they are from dying of Covid.
Planning to go to Gettysburg for today so that should be interesting. Always a varied cross section of people there so I expect to see many wearing masks despite the beautiful weather we are expecting for the day.
I still wear my mask in the grocery or convenience store, not outside. Use wipes on the grocery cart. Have been going to cas shoots where no one wears a mask. My family have all had both our doses of moderna but 2 weeks ago my 11 yr old granddaughter caught covid. She luckily is ok but who knows what damage it caused her that will show up later. Planning a 7 state trip later this summer and will stay with vaccinated friends. If masks don’t work why was there no 2020 flu season? Just saying. Get a shot, save your life.
We just didn't hear about it, or it was called covid.Quote:
Originally Posted by baltimoreed
COVID is of course a strain of the flu variant. This is in the same strain as that to the Spanish Flu that killed.
The 1918 Spanish influenza lasted from 1918 to 1920 and consisted of four waves.
The first wave lasted approximately from 15 February 1918 to 1 June 1918;
the second wave lasted approximately from 1 August 1918 to 2 December 1918;
the third wave lasted approximately from 3 December 1918 to 30 April 1919;
the fourth wave lasted approximately from 1 December 1919 to 30 April 1920.
It infected about 500 million people, roughly one-third of the world’s population at that time, and resulted in the deaths of 50 million, including 675,000 Americans.
The first public news of the epidemic appeared in Madrid on 22 May 1918 in Madrid’s ABC newspaper; hence, it became known as the Spanish influenza. However, there is no definite evidence of origination, and most epidemiologists and virologists believe that the virus originated in either the USA or France.
Comparison between COVID-19 and 1918 influenza:
While the 1918 influenza killed a disproportionate number of 25–40 year olds, COVID-19 mostly affects those over the age of 65, especially those also with comorbidities.
In particular, the mortality rate for the influenza rose to 8%–10% for younger people compared with a 2.5% overall mortality whereas the mortality rate for the 25–40-year-old age range is a mere 0.2% in contrast to the 2.4% overall mortality rate.
Those aged 25–40 year olds accounted for 40% of deaths from the 1918 influenza, whereas those in the 18–44-year-old range account for only 3.9% of deaths from COVID-19.
More countries were spared in the 1918 pandemic, whereas only the smaller Pacific Islands (Soloman Islands and Vanuata) remain COVID-19 free.
The mortality rate for pregnant women with the Spanish influenza was 23%–37% and 26% of those who survived lost their child, whereas the mortality rate of pregnant women with COVID-19 is unknown.
The Spanish influenza resulted in acute illness in 25%–30% of the world population, with over 50 million deaths, whereas COVID-19 has infected nearly 55 million to date, with 1.3 million deaths.
In the USA alone, COVID-19 cases are at over 11 million as of 16 November 2020, which is nearly a 40% increase from the month prior.
Second, the two diseases kill via different mechanisms. While those with the influenza died of secondary bacterial pneumonia, those with COVID-19 died from an overactive immune response that resulted in multiple organ failure.
Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome (ARDS) can develop in both cases.
As a complication from the influenza, ARDS had an 100% fatality rate compared with a 53.4% mortality rate as a complication from COVID-19.
The projected economic impact of COVID-19 on the US economy alone is a $5.76–$6.17 trillion decrease in gross domestic product (GDP), based on Fitch Ratings and the US GDP according to the World Bank. The economic data during the 1918 pandemic is scarce, but it was noted that Mexico suffered a $9 billion loss.
When one considers that in 1918 there were none of the public information systems such as the internet etc so news of the disease as it spread was telegram and little else!!
Here we are today with everything at our fingertips and we seem to have a comparison building up, on level playing fields as 1918.
Thank God for so many talented physicians today who together, came up with the vaccines that would have made Marie Curie so proud!!!!
And Einstein by perfecting time travel for the long term testing while they were at it :)
Anecdotal evidence is no evidence at all. There was a flu season, it was just mixed in with Covid. It was lower than usual but that's because of the shutdown and social distancing. Had nothing to do with the masks. Masks were extensively tested when SARS was a threat. N95 masks were shown to be the absolute minimum for any type of effectiveness and that was only if they were worn properly. Cloth masks have zero effect of stopping the virus. What should have been done and what would have worked just as well or even better is only those who had symptoms of any type wear a mask, or better yet, stay home. Cloth masks do have the benefit of stopping large water droplets which can reduce the spread.
But here in the states, they were afraid that people wearing masked would be ostracized and we just can't have that. Everyone has to be the same.
I managed to get a cold in the middle of the complete shutdown, minimum store visits and mask wearing. Had three actually over the main phase of the pandemic. I have a fourth now. There are over 200 causes of the common cold and four of them are corona viruses which could be causing false positives in many people.
The 1918 Flu was spread around the world by troops during and returning from WW1. The transport and hygene standards of the time made it easy.
After WW1 the returning troops would probably have stayed in their home country for the most part. The lack of travel opportunity was helpful in slowing down the virus and the development of herd immunity, as well as slowing down development of different variants.
Today we have better general hygene; but international travel is so easy and normal these days; that it's let the virus spread virtually everywhere.
This means we are faced with different mutations and will likely keep it going longer than the 1918 pandemic. Vaccinations will reduce the death rates; but it's not over yet!
The fear and discomfort that a possible reality evokes is in direct proportion to its unpleasantness, and to the urgency that it be confronted and understood.
:wave:
Not much Covid talk in Pennsylvania these days. Most of the news seems to be coming out of California where a few counties are implementing mask mandates again. Sherriff came out yesterday and said he isn't going to enforce them because there's no scientific data that they actually work and it goes against current CDC guidelines. Some continued fear mongering that the Delta strain is going to do this and do that but so far none of it has materialized. Vaccination rates in US have slowed dramatically, it seems everyone that wants to get vaccinated has and the government pressure isn't working.
Businesses are still being disrupted dramatically and no one seems to have a handle on why. Construction futures plummeted recently yet prices remain high. I personally ordered a bunch of windows 12 weeks ago. Was told they would take 10 weeks to arrive. Initially pushed back to August 2nd and then with no real explanation why January of next year. My supplier contacted another company and this one will deliver them in four weeks. We cancelled and moved the order. The first company says they can't get glass made, but the second company is having no problems. Nor are several other window companies. I have door orders that keep getting pushed back also. Yesterday I purchased a 12' 2x6 that cost $26, about three times what it should so prices not coming down yet.
One thing that's happening is the lumber yards bought all this stuff at the high prices and they need to sell it before they can get new in at the lower prices. But I think a lot of companies now stopped buying to wait on the lower prices. I've been working time and materials this entire time to protect myself from the price increases.
They should be dropping, volume sales will dull the loss. Just the cost of doing business v/s losing business.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
I was wondering about that today when I picked up some lumber. An 8' 2x12 was $56. Current price on an 8' 2x4 is $10. They were around $2 when the pandemic started. I don't think these prices can be sustained at all yet wandering around the yard today, they are fully stocked now. I'm expecting Home Depot and Lowes will be cutting prices first and more dramatically and that's where the business will go. I know I will go there. I normally do anyway but this is a local time and materials job and my labor costs for driving to Lowes would be cost prohibitive.Quote:
Originally Posted by browningautorifle
So when do they take the loss to keep the business. What I see is they have hired a lot of new people, cut hours, closed on Saturdays and yet they can't get my windows and doors on time. It's a little aggravating.
I'm wondering too, it should be soon according to economist theory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
I am now waiting for tens of thousands of maskless looters in SA to start dropping like flies after the hundreds of super spreader events they partook in 7 to 10 days ago. Unfortunately that is not going to happen as what people are being led to believe about masks and virus spread and the severity of the virus is not correct. And I am sure you will be hard pressed to find even 10 amongst the lot who have had the shots.
I also had close contact with lots of maskless uninjected people that responded with me to the situation. We walked and stood in groups, we waited in vehicles with other people, etc. And nobody sanitized after helping someone else get their gear on.
The rioting and looting had a number of combined root causes. One of them was this whole covid mismanaged (worldwide) f...up that caused people to lose their jobs and slide into poverty even further (further because they were already there due to the communist/socialist government the world forced unto the country).
So lets see. The next two weeks are sure to have the streets filling up with virus infested bodies if everything people are being told and are forced into doing is true.
I'm following the situation in SA very carefully, because we have a big machine to install in East London and we had to hold the technical team back.
The guys over there seem to be pretty calm, but there are a few signs that maybe not everything is really ok.
Adding to that, East London is not the best run city in the country from what I have always seen...
---------- Post added at 08:54 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:53 AM ----------
Concerning the piles of bodies, I bet there will be none of them.
I don't have the pessimistic view other people have of South Africa. Still the best country in the world to live in. Except for the politicians.
The violence was cause by faction politics in the ruling party, which still calls itself a movement. Of course, many other contributing factors, which I view as minor to the political one.
Be aware that the media portrays the worst scenes as that is what sells. While not knowing the security situation in East London, I wouldn't hesitate to go there to work or on business. But that is just me.
It's my understanding that a lot of people are leaving South Africa, not necessarily of their own choosing. Confiscated farms, etc.
As for riots causing super spreader events, the United States has proven that rioting is fine and safe against Covid. It's going to church that is bad. Must be the heat from the flames of the burning businesses that kill off the airborne virus.
Funny thing though. Texas Democrat representatives all fled the state to stop a vote that would limit their ability to commit additional fraud in future elections. They chartered a plane, flew to Washington DC, met with senior Democrat leaders there, had some parties, etc and at least six of them now tested positive for Covid and they infected numerous DC functionary's. The VP had to get checked because she was part of the party crowd.
AFAIK, a lot of people aren't leaving South Africa, except if the emigration process has been completed. The emigration process is lengthy, involved, includes a lot of money and quite challenging due to Covid regulations at your destination. Just leaving immediately means leaving all your money and assets behind and arriving elsewhere with nothing. And then trying to get residence, job, etc. Nope, might happen after Covid.
AFAIK know no farms have been confiscated, or contemplated to be confiscated. I live here and should know.
On the other hand, land restitution without compensation is a hotly debated topic, with draft legislation still in process. Possible finalisation end of 2022 but probably 2023.
I’d come to SA, but right now I have few projects. I’m hoping to get some new stuff running in the next months.
Also, I have to admit, traveling is no fun these days…
But I’m looking forward to come and bother your SA guys a bit:D
Travelling is still fun but the accompanying regulations, quarantine, etc, isn't.
Looking forward to being bothered.
Traveling by car or by motorbike is still great fun, but as soon as you get near an airport or a train station, any long-range public transport, you get involved in such an unpleasant environment.
Plus, all the trouble you have to go through upon return right now.
I have two weeks of quarantine if I go out of the EU, with few exceptions.
"Carrot vs Stick. The carrot is no longer going to work...", by CNN Senior Vice President Sam Feist.
I love it when liberals lower their mask and show their true colours.
We had very similar situations here lately.
The stick was always there, just hidden. Sometimes they inadvertently let it show and then the people who saw it and commented on it were portrayed as (put your choice here). When something is forced on to people, it is wrong. Vac passport, yellow star, ...
But we still believe in this frigging world…
Another day at the vaccination centre.
Goooooood day everybody!
Attachment 118803
Good to see you Alpini...
Likewise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daan Kemp
And PE was ok this round. Just the normal small scale looting activities going on.
'It seems no shooting range has been spared.
What they couldn't carry away from our range in PE, they just broke and destroyed. They even went as far as breaking our safety areas down. One pig was so kind, he/she/it took a dump in a toilet and then broke the cistern and water pipes off, before removing the door and door frame.
They have mined the back stops to such a degree that we had to get a TLB in to push new ones.
Also don't think having people at the range is a deterrent. We had a night shoot a few months back and miners were busy digging under moon light and then ran away. The fact that about 20 people were having a after match braai meant nothing.
We had to get a crane truck in during lock down to turn our containers door to door.'
Lots of South African emigrants in Canada.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daan Kemp
Latter-day trekkers I guess you could call them.
It's over, demographically and in every other sense.
Africa will be China's "problem" in future and China will solve that problem slowly but inexorably.
Many there would believe it is their natural right to do so, and one could certainly make that case; they value their own nation and culture enough to reproduce and thereby preserve it.
Those who can't be bothered to do so, despite all the luxuries of life in the Western World since WWII? They have decided their own fate.
Really doesn't seem to be much happening other than the government getting more frantic about people getting vaccinated. Several states and cities are making it mandatory to be vaccinated or tested weekly. The news seems hung up on the south having very low vaccination rates and how hospitalizations are rising dramatically, deaths are not and the numbers in many of the southern states were never high to begin with. They continue to find these rare individuals who had very bad reactions to try to get people to get vaccinated. Also making a big issue about blacks not getting the vaccine and wondering why. Several prominent black leaders and the Democrats were telling them not to get vaccinated and making comparisons to WWII era government testing all last year when Trump was President. That's why. The Veterans Administration made vaccines mandatory for all employees making it the first government agency to do so.
Steve,
Wasn't he the man who was going to inject disinfectant straight into the blood stream/ Thank God he hasn't still got the keys around his neck :madsmile::lol:
caught the tail end of the news...the ticker said something like Sydney went in to another lockdown after a few new cases reported? Then showed protesters being dispersed by mounted troops, and some govt person giving a speech about how the lockdown was all their fault...if they would just shut up and stay home the lockdown would run its course and end. I suppose if you threw a free and innocent person in jail they should just wait it out and all will be fine and over in due course? no harm done right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
Seriously though, what is the real scoop?
Not so seriously, though...https://www.foxnews.com/world/nude-s...ockdown-orders I suppose if I were naked, and confronted by a deer with a big rack, I'd take off running too.
If you mean Trump, the man responsible for getting the vaccine out as fast as it was, yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gil Boyd
Hydrogen Peroxide is a common disinfectant used in medical facilities because it has no scent. It has also been used to treat viral infections through intravenous use and lung nebulizers, and it is this that Trump referred to. Nancy Pelosi is the one that told the world he wanted them to inject bleach which he did no such thing.
Hydrogen Peroxide exists naturally in the human body, increasing it's concentration has been a long established means of fighting viral infections. It was even used with great effectiveness during the Spanish Flu outbreak at the end of WWI. It's not new, it's major problem is it's dirt cheap and you can't make money off it.
But Trump said it, he had to be made to look like an idiot so the media went with bleach, everyone believed it and here we are. Another inexpensive treatment discounted because of the hatred of one man.
---------- Post added at 07:01 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:51 AM ----------
Things might get interesting here in the US again as the CDC has done an about face on the mask issue again. New recommendations are the wearing of masks indoors by everyone, vaccinated or not, in areas where there is a significant outbreak of Covid. Substantial transmission means that a county is reporting between 50 to 100 cases per 100,000 over a week and high transmission means that a county is reporting more than 100 cases per 100,000 over a week. Apparently they can track all this.
Interesting side note, they also just got rid of the PCR test so how will they make a determination of who has it and who doesn't although it can continue to be used until the end of the year. They at least acknowledged it is faulty.
I personally do not think people will go back to wearing masks. There remain a few that have continued to wear them but the vast majority no longer do vaccinated or not.
One thing I'm finding fascinating is the extreme difficulty I'm having finding the death data for the United States. Several trackers stopped tracking in March. The CDC doesn't even have a link I can find, searches take you to the new cases. What limited information I can find is that the deaths continue to decline even while cases go up slightly. Total deaths can be found but not the old daily trackers which showed trends.
Steve,
Agreed in principal, at that press conference that was shared around the world, it was of course the bit they wanted you to see that they played to make him look like an imbecile, when he said inject disinfectant.
We were shown on the other side of the pond, body bags in lorry refrigerator containers outside morgues in one City in the U.S, and it was supposed to be commonplace in most cities, so the figures might turn out to be high, but as we all know the press need to hype everything up as it sells papers andmakes news!!!
Well, it is easier after all to just take their word for it right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
I was waiting for the body bags to start piling up after all our recent super spreader events, but not even one little heap :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Gil Boyd
I just found out that coming to good ole SA is not a big problem right now. Not even quarantine upon return. I’ll start planning for September. Let’s hope.
My technicians seem to be required a visum. But then on other sites not. Who knows…
You never know, like the Spanish Flu of 1919 it might just dissapear and burn itself out...................here's hoping!!
I forget what the deal was with the refrigerator trucks and the body bags. It wasn't what they made it out to be, that much I remember. It most certainly wasn't common. There were maybe half a dozen cities that had the temporary morgues and trucks and most of them were for only a short period. El Paso was one I think, NYC.
They track excess deaths which are the numbers of deaths above a 5 year average. Last year we were about 10-11% higher than usual. This year the stats for this have also disappeared because we are well below average for the year. Those that were going to die, died last year. I was making note of this in my earlier posts. The nice little charts and graphs on this ended in January which is when the decline started.
One of the articles I did find was a comparison of Covid to the Spanish influenza. Covid deaths in the US have now surpassed that of the Spanish Influenza. They of course make a huge deal of this and omit that the population of the US was a fraction of what it is now and if the rate was the same, deaths from Covid would be five times larger than they actually are.
It's a curious thing pandemic modelling, the problem being that the people commissioning the work have a particular axe to grind and slant the results accordingly....
Here's an alarming one, the latest modeling from the UK last night, they have worked out that, should the UK have not had been so quick off the mark, getting people vaccinated, we would have had 60,000 more deaths by now .... To put that into context, about a third more!
It's a sobering number guys....
I must admit that I don't understand anything anymore about this pandemic. And I'm trusting no one anymore.
As I already wrote since long time, I keep behaving responsibly towards other people, respecting the basic rules when with people and under a roof, but doing what I want and feel like doing when in the open or at home. Or with friends.
I'm vaccinated and don't want to hear any more Bravo Sierra about being infective potentially, about swabs, about limitations to my freedom.
I did what they wanted and I too felt was right, now stop busting my b...!
I am slowly coming to the conclusion that they want a civil war in the United States. For what purpose I have no idea but they are attempting to bring back mask mandates and over half the nation is simply going to refuse.
We've seen what they do, nothing. Same with the shutdowns which they are also talking about.
The US House of Representatives and the US Senate are in the same building. Different chambers, one on the left, one on the right. The House Speaker, Pelosi is mandating masks, I think they've all been vaccinated by now. So you go into the House side and the Capitol Police see you without a mask, they are to arrest you and fine you $1000 for the first offense. This is for Congressmen, I don't think she has the authority to do anything to people coming in off the street but who knows. The Senate side has no mandate. It's ridiculous.
Leftist cities are the first to go with the mandates.
This Babylonbee (satire site) post about says it all: Compromise Reached: Everyone Still Afraid Of COVID Will Be Locked Down, Everyone Else Will Live Lives As Normal | The Babylon Bee
The CDC has come out with another asinine move recommending masks for school children who this disease does not affect and who we now know are very low at even getting it or transmitting it. Our Governor, big time leftist that went overboard with the shutdowns has surprisingly, no shockingly stated Pennsylvania will not institute a mask mandate for schools. Perhaps he got the message that his days would be numbered if he did.
We had Biden say that people on an airliner when eating would have to pull the mask down to bite, then put it up to chew. LOL what a fiasco. He is also starting to mandate vaccinations for federal employees.
All this for a disease that is now below the seasonal flu in cases and danger. Cases are going up a bit but deaths have continued to go down as well has hospitalizations to the point they no longer mention them. They can't mention them, it destroys their entire narrative of fear.
Traveling a bit this extended weekend. In Cleveland Ohio, about 6 hours from home. News is about the same as home. Increasing numbers of confirmed cases etc. You must wear a mask or we're all going to die.
Wait staff is for the most part masking. A very small percentage of everyone else is. Life going on as normal for the most part. Museum we walked past last night kind of creeped me out. There where about 100 people inside seated, staring forward towards the glass, all wearing the identical mask. Hundreds of candles in front of the glass. I mentioned it looked like a cult meeting of some sort to my daughter and she laughed and said they were watching a performance. Sure enough, there was a woman playing a violin that I hadn't seen.
This was the science museum. We were touring the museum next door, the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Very few masks in there.
What a wonderful snapshot of the current state of the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
I just came back from Holland and then Germany. In Holland, apart from the airport, no mask required.
Handshakes, normal life.
In Germany: FFP2 mask mandatory, lots of people keeping the mask also outside, but also lots who don't.
Different feeling.
Germany put Holland in the high risk areas on past Sunday, so I've been thoroughly checked when I entered Germany from Amsterdam, but being vaccinated, I had no problems.
In any case, again in Europe, everybody goes his own way...
And we call it Union...
Thats why we came out..............................not everybody was singing off the same songsheet to which this testifys :madsmile:
I appreciate many of the advantages of the EU, but I really hate the hypocrisy of the rhetorics about the common land, etc. It is just a bunch of countries which try to step over each other while stepping all together over their citizen.
In the name of freedom and democracy.
Follow up on the mask policies while traveling. No place in Cleveland we went required masks and maybe 5% were wearing them, only the science museum I mentioned earlier had a requirement and we didn't go there. Pittsburgh had one place, the Aviary, that required them. No idea why but people were complying. Even the Heinz museum didn't require them but I don't know who exactly controls that. It's a Smithsonian affiliate museum which I didn't know existed outside of Washington DC. Perhaps the Heinz family whose widow is an ultra liberal married to John Kerry doesn't control it in any way anymore.
The Flight 93 memorial however is a Federal building and they were being pretty anal about it. Not in Pittsburgh but out in the boonies east of Pittsburgh by about an hour.
The teachers union in a huge flip flop is now recommending all teachers get vaccinated. This is to protect the children too young to be vaccinated. Yes, those same children at zero risk for detrimental effects of covid. We are wondering who got paid, by whom and by how much.
My wife's weather app is now telling her how many new cases of Covid and how many deaths there are in Pennsylvania.
Obama had a massive birthday party that is being widely criticized and they came up with the usual excuses. It was an enlightened vaccinated crowd. They banned pictures but they still got out. Almost 500 initially invited but they scaled it back about 100 people who I guess they decided weren't important enough.
Someone I know got her first shot on the 4th and bragged about it on FB. Guess who has spent the last 5 days in bed apparently feeling worse than she ever has before in her life.
We now have the “green pass” for plenty activities. Again, without any coherence.
If I want to go to a restaurant, I need it to eat inside. Not for outside.
Cooks, waiters, other personnel don’t need it…
That is just an example.
I keep living as I decided to.
I have the “pass”, but many people don’t, just because the vaccination campaign did not yet reach everybody.
One is my daughter, the middle one. At 15, she needs it. But she won’t get the first jab until the end of the month.
Apart from the fact that I’m not convinced about vaccinating kids, what is the fault of those who just got the jab set for the end of August, mid September, later still?
Why should they be discriminated if they never refused the vaccine but were put at the bottom of the list due to age?
If she can’t go somewhere, then “somewhere” can scr…w itself and we’ll gome somewhere else or organise something at home.
My tolerance is reaching its limit…
I don't have a dog in this fight. But. Heard recently of smallpox, mumps, polio, rubella, etc infections? No? Some vaccinations work. Makes sense to me to take all the precautions, including vaccination. Especially those nearest and dearest.
Amen!Quote:
Originally Posted by Daan Kemp
No doubt. But they were not accompanied by the same mess we have today.
I got my vaccine at the first opportunity. But all the fuss around this virus, all the contradictory measures, all the misinformation…
That is really driving me crazy.
Covid is none of those diseases, the "vaccine" is not a vaccine. It is similar to a flu shot. It may or may not work, it will have to be changed every time Covid mutates. It is also completely untested for long term effects. It takes about 5 years for a vaccine to be approved, this was rushed, it remains for emergency use only. Children are in no emergency, this disease barely affects them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daan Kemp
If it’s not a vaccine, and vaccines take about 5 years to be approved, then how long does it take, let’s say, a flu shot to get approved?
well, yes, but a different matter altogether.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daan Kemp
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/30/near...past-year.html
The flu has been around for 102 years, it's the Spanish Flu from 1918. It mutated and there are numerous strains of it circulating the globe. The flu shot has been around for quite a while and with it they have to take an educated guess as to what strain is going to be prevalent where, say the US that season and that's what they put into the flu shot for that region. Sometimes they get it right, sometimes they don't or more than one strain is in the region at the same time that they did not anticipate. The effectiveness of the flu shot is not for a lifetime, the body just doesn't retain the anti-bodies longer than a few years.Quote:
Originally Posted by rcathey
Covid now has four different strains. The "vaccine" was designed for the first and it was only about 85% or so effective against that. They say it is close to the same with the first two mutations but not the Delta or Indian variant where it is closer to 45% effective. But even with this, it lessons the severity of the illness, just as a flu shot will against the wrong variant.
Vaccines can't be made for things that mutate. A vaccine also normally gives the individual a lifetime immunity against that which it protects against, they have no idea how long the Covid shot is effective. Diseases like the mumps, smallpox, etc are effectively protected against by vaccines. They don't mutate and it is believed that there is a lifetime immunity against them. They actually stopped immunizing against smallpox because they believe it to be eliminated worldwide which it isn't because both the US and Russian governments have stockpiles of it in labs. I also read that it may only be effective for 50 years meaning even us old folks could be threatened by smallpox if some nation not as honorable as others, say China, and who have little qualms about releasing a virus on the rest of the world, like China would get their hands on some smallpox vials from an underfunded, understaffed, corrupt Russian lab.
It kinda sounds like your entire issue with the Covid “shot” is based in semantics. It’s an injection that offers people protection (even up to 45% against delta, which it wasn’t even designed for, according to your source) from a potentially deadly virus — call it whatever you wish I suppose. But people should be encouraged to get it.
I’ve seen a lot of posts in this thread I haven’t necessarily agreed with but have tried to just stay away. I couldn’t any longer when I thought (thought…appears now I was wrong) that the use of a potentially life saving “injection” was being discouraged.
The reason mutations like delta exists and was able to take hold is because people were hesitant to get the “injection” for whatever reason yet continues to ignore all the other safety precautions. It’s pretty simple, the more people that are infected, the more chance for mutation.
Not exactly, I prefer the truth. People believe when they are vaccinated they are protected from the disease. As this is not a vaccine, that is incorrect. The reluctance to get the shot stems from a complete lack of openness about this "vaccine". It has side effects, it has killed many people, it has caused miscarriages and yes these things happen with true vaccines all the time. But in this one instance, they are denying it is happening. Throw that in with Bill Gates involvement (a known population control proponent) and people don't trust it at all. Tell the truth. When a million people are vaccinated, one or .0001% may die. This is actually the rate of death for the smallpox vaccine. Compare that with the death rate from smallpox of 30% and you have a substantial incentive to be vaccinated to prevent it. Now it has been essentially eradicated from the world. This will never occur with Covid.Quote:
Originally Posted by rcathey
We do have an idea of the death rate from Covid, for those under 50 it is very low, lower than the seasonal flu. For those over 50, the rate increases with age. Under 65, it's still pretty low, over 75 and it becomes very high but even at that age, the survival rate is close to 95%. It is not as deadly as many people believe it is.
We have no idea of the death rate from the "vaccine" because they are not telling us, they are denying there are complications from it which we know to be false. There have been over 5000 deaths attributed to the vaccine in the US alone out of about 350 million doses administered. That isn't people, it's shots as it takes two for anyone other than the J&J. and not everyone has gotten two that were supposed to. The CDC has not found a direct link between any of those 5000 and the vaccine, not a single one they will state actually died as a result of the vaccine. Even though they were healthy before the shot and not after receiving it which is why it was reported to the VARS system. England has had similar results. These reporting systems have been shut down, the studies ended, etc. Just makes you wonder.
As for lifesaving, yes, for those over the age of 50. For those under the age of 50, it isn't needed. The death rate for those under 50 is a fraction of what it is for the common flu and there has never been any mandate to get the flu shot. This drive for under 50 and now for under 18 again creates distrust.
And finally, those that get the "vaccine" still get infected so it makes zero difference in the rate of mutation. Roughly half of the new cases are among those that already have been vaccinated. I saw a report over the weekend on network news that the viral load, the amount of the virus carried by those who were vaccinated is twice as large as those who were not vaccinated. Scientifically, this makes little sense to me but it is a great excuse to make everyone wear a mask again.
And the mask issue hasn't helped either. Masks do nothing against this disease or it's spread. Mandatory mask usage has actually been shown to increase the case load in some areas rather than decrease it. Then they told us we get vaccinated, we don't need to wear the useless mask anymore yet they are now reinstituting the mask requirements, despite no evidence they actually do anything.
And finally, they want people who have had Covid already to get vaccinated. Why? There is no reason to, they already have the anti-bodies which the vaccine is supposed to create. This is true with nearly every disease out there. This creates the image that there is something more to the vaccine than protecting against the disease.
Haven't you wondered how they have all these new statistics stating that the vast majority of cases are now the Delta variant? There is no test being given for the Delta variant. It takes a very specialized and expensive test to make this determination and they are not doing it with all these people. They are still using the PCR test which is being withdrawn because it is inaccurate in December.
I'm not against the "vaccine", my wife and I were both vaccinated pretty early on when they were approved, late March. My oldest children were also vaccinated. My youngest have decided to not get vaccinated and I don't have a problem with that decision. I'm more worried about them getting it than not getting it.
I think the mask mandates are incredibly stupid, the attempts to make children wear them even more so. They tried masks with the Spanish Flu and Fauci himself wrote an article about how the masks actually increased the rate of death back then. Fauci also did not want us wearing masks at the beginning of this outbreak one of the few times he was being truthful.
Respiratory virus vaccines, like covid and the yearly flu, do not prevent infection. They only give the body a head start, whereby the infection never makes it to symptomatic illness. This used to be a well known fact. Vaccinated people are still being infected, still testing positive, still transmitting it to everyone else, vaccinated and unvaccinated alike, and the virus will continue to mutate just like the annual flu does. It's always been the case that many people only hear what they want to hear, sad that now we only hear what we are told to hear.Quote:
Originally Posted by rcathey
Looking forward to the annual Flu injection+ no doubt will incorporate lots of extra things!!
Shame they don't give us oldies a McDonalds FREE meal to ensure you have the injection or a FREE Colonel Sanders Kentucky meal, or a FREE cinema ticket...................Only in the UK, true story.............................unbelievable :madsmile:
Here they want to give everyone $100 to get the vaccine. I want to know what the people who already got it get. It's just ridiculous. Next time they try to get people to get vaccinated, they will refuse hoping to get paid to do so and next time it might just be a disease that is a serious threat. Covid isn't even as bad as the original Spanish Flu and everyone is going nuts over it.
I wonder who innoculates the Taliban........................:madsmile:
Probably no one. I live in a heavily populated Amish area and they aren't getting vaccinated, never social distanced, never stopped gathering in large numbers. In other words, they lived their lives as normal. No massive outbreaks, no massive death numbers, nothing out of the ordinary. And unlike the Taliban, they aren't hiding in caves. They are out in full force at the farmers markets, shopping in Walmart, etc, no masks, even at the height of everything. They have been studying another large Amish group in Ohio that has a vaccination rate of 14%.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gil Boyd
"some Amish were hospitalized, but we learn that “this year hasn’t seen much more illness than others…in terms of people not feeling well enough to be out and about. Many people lost their sense of smell and taste, and some felt like they had the flu, but few felt worse than that.”
Like in other Amish communities, it is thought that “many people in the community did contract the coronavirus at some point.” Few have been tested, unless hospitalized. But a local funeral director confirms that there has been a “lack” of deaths due to COVID there."
I realize they put their faith in God and don't worry about death at all but that isn't going to change anything. What you don't see much of in the Amish community is overweight, out of shape individuals. I have a client who while not Amish is Old Order Mennonite which is pretty close in lifestyle. No car, no TV, no Radio. Does have electricity. She's in her 80's and makes me feel badly out of shape with her activity level. Always on the move.
Our big local farmers market shut down for a few weeks early on, then opened only the outdoor portion and finally the indoor portion. Half the stands are run by Amish or Mennonite families and no masks the entire time. My town is surrounded by them, they own many of the small stores and a few of the larger ones around here. The big stores complied with state directives for the most part but the small ones didn't. We never had a massive outbreak, the hospital was never overwhelmed, not even close. Our schools opened a week behind schedule and remained open to in person learning the entire year. The Amish and Mennonites have one room schoolhouses all over the place and the kids were outside playing at recess like normal so we all knew they were in school.
Pfizer's vaccine has been officially approved by the FDA in the United States now.
I'm kind of amazed as what they will do to push these vaccines on people. This has been in existence for less than a year so obviously there has been no long term studies done which IS required for the approval process. We have the politicians and the pharmaceutical companies telling us this isn't new that it's been around for over 10 years. True in a way, the research has been around for 15 years, the testing has not. That again, is less than a year.
So now Biden is telling private companies to mandate it for their employees.
It isn't going to work. They screwed the pooch on this one. According to them, not a single adverse side effect has occurred with the vaccines yet easily obtainable evidence proves they are lying through their teeth.
I've said it before, I'll say it again, TELL THE TRUTH. Maybe people with accept the small risk involved.
Point seems to be moot, people are still getting it, the vaccine isn't preventing it, it's going to be here forever. What I'm wondering is if Australia and New Zealand are going to stay shut down forever.
:rofl:
So I have to travel to the UK this weekend because my Mum is in hospital. I didn't realise how complicated it is to go from France to England! Oh my! it's madness!
So to travel I've got my Vaccine Pass, ( both jab's complete) but I have also done a fresh PCR test (negative). Both of these are Free of Charge in France.
Then I have to fill out a passenger locater form which is 4 pages of personal info and travel info etc; BUT the last thing you need to complete the form is code for your pre payed Day 2 test. (Arrival day is day Zero)
Even if you are leaving within 48 hours and won't use the test, you are obliged to pay and book it or you can't travel!
Cheapest I could find was 59 pounds. What a total rip off!
My dearest friends… I came back from Germany yesterday evening. Been to Belgium, France and Switzerland the past week…
There is NO logic in the way Covid related things are treated…
To get back home, I have to fill the PLF (passenger locator form) for Italy.
It wants me to give such detailed info, that I have to laugh my asp off every time! And NO-ONE ever checks me.
Today, after 6 months, we shut down our vaccination centre in my town. We made more than 70.000 full vaccinations here, only based on voluntary work.
I’m almost sad…that it’s over…
But today I did intervene during the official celebrations, during the chat of the politicians. I raised my hand and… I never talk, so my Alpinis shut everybody down.
I just said that, after having traveled through Europe since may 2020 during this pandemics, I must say, that I never saw such a well run vaccination center like here. With so many jabs done at almost no cost, due to our voluntary work.
I had to stop after a while, ‘cause I was getting a tad emotional, but I could swear to God that we did a frigging great job!
Alpini’s, sanitary workers, other volunteers… they all cheered. We were one great body… Strange feeling, but unbelievably intense.
Let’s wait for the next “pandemics” now…
I’m a happy guy tonight!
Really doesn't seem like a lot is happening here other than talk. All the talk is simply an extension of the politics of the situation.
Not really any shutdowns or restrictions happening that I'm aware of. Life is close to normal. The schools in Pennsylvania have a mask mandate which has no scientific basis but they are not as strict as last year. My kids will not have to wear masks while they are competing, just while waiting to compete which is good because the masks caused their glasses to fog up while they were shooting.
The biggest controversy is various vaccinne mandates being made by the health care industry for their employees. There is a fairly large percentage of health care workers that refuse the vaccinne. Doctors, nurses and support staff. These are the same people that worked overtime through the entire pandemic, many of them being exposed to Covid, had it and recovered from it but they are told to be vaccinated when they don't need it. They have the anitbodies already. Not all, many never had it and simply don't want the vaccinne. They are being fired which is now causeing a shortage of staff in hospitals. Makes a lot of sense.
Those in the military are covered by Biden's federal mandate and they are being told now they will be given dishonorable discharges if they do not get the vaccine. Meanwhile, Congress and the Justice system are under no such requirements because neither is under the President's control.
So the problems continue, just on a smaller scale and most seem to have lost interest in following along.
The backlash ot the Covid restrictions are now becoming visible.
CHOP is the Children's hospital of Philadelphia. It is a 585 bed pediatric hospital and it is filled to overflowing. There are fewer than a dozen Covid 19 patients. They are overflowing because of non-Covid respiratory illnesses and mental health crisises.
It seems that the children being isolated for nearly two years has affected their immune systems in a very bad way. People need to have contact with things to maintain their physical health. Antiseptic environments have left them with no need for a high immune response and thus their systems are now weak because of it. So we are entering a flu season which is much more dangerous to kids than Covid and their immune systems are not prepared for it. The second half of the problem is severe anxiety, depression and suicidal thoughts which the hospital is not set up to help. The isolation of the pandemic have magnified these mental health issues.
30Three,
The sad reality is, that both Governments are now making all aspects of travel and business as difficult as they can, like a game of one upmanship. The cancelled Submarine contract from Australia just compounded difficult times since BREXIT. We get the blame regardless, even though others awarded a British company a contract for a Nuclear Submarine compared to a Diesel/Electric one!! Nothing to do with countries but technology I'm afraid.
Hope your mum is well and welcome to England.
Thanks Gil; I was a bit wound up last week trying to fill the 4 page forms to travel and being obliged to pay for a pointless test, when all I really wanted to do is book and go. The system is over complicated and I think more politic driven than health driven.
(submarines, fishing etc etc)
Unfortunately; my Mum is now in end of life care.
One thing that I was impressed with at the weekend, was the medical staff in the hospital; absolutely brilliant.
That is the important thing at this point. So many people have been left alone…Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Three
Keep the spirit up.
Agreed! Super scary stuff. Thank God the flu vaccine is so readily available!Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243