1907 Bayonet Grips - Repair or replace?

[Flying10uk]

One of the more difficult issues surrounding the restoration of any item is deciding, when a part needs attention, whether to repair or replace. I purchased a 1907 bayonet by Chapman at a militaria fair last year and, slightly embarrassingly, I didn't notice that someone had ground a slice out of the side of the cross guard, taking a little wood off one grip in the process. The reason why anyone would consider it necessary to grind the side of the cross guard is a complete mystery. I have built up the missing metal with weld, very carefully placed in the required place on the cross guard and then dressed back to size.

The dilemma which I have are the wood grips which, on one side, are damaged by the grinding of the cross guard and on the other, around the screw/nut counter bores. I have a pair of new old stock grips which I could use as replacements or I could try to tidy up the originals by taking a slither off the surface and then light sanding. With these grips I don't believe that I can remove all the damage by reducing the thickness because it will likely make them too thin.

I am open to suggestions and thoughts from members on whether it's better to replace the grips but lose the Patina/history or retain the originals, trying to make them look as best as possible, but having to put up with the obvious damage? I don't think that there is a right or a wrong answer here but I would appreciate a reason for answering in a particular way, please.

Thank-you for any advice.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[CINDERS]

My 1916 Chapman has pretty munted grips I too have spares and to put them on it would detract from its history and really make it look like I dunno a tarted up POS. But thats just me F10 its your bayonet.

[Doco overboard]

Before I change anything I would consider how I would maintain the current grips with the piece. If they were going to be permanently separated and then lost to the bayonet I would leave them with it. However, not being a well versed student of the particular type of bayonet it does appear to me that the original grips may already be a replacement or already altered because of the lack of milling marks to the grips. You have mentioned a weld to the cross guard and if the subsequent repair requires additional work to blend the repair or a significant radical change to the entire appearance occurs I would use the new grip scales. Only you can decide, but if it were my project I would maintain the current grips and use the NOS replacements only in the case of significant damage or to replace a part that is not entirely serviceable.

[Peter Laidler]

I think that you've effectively answered your own question. You've fixed the bayonet. Why? - because it was was butchered and now it's fixed. Or it WILL be when you get it correctly blackened again. So what on earth would possess you to leave a set of old manky grips on it? So fix the grips too! Don't even bother using those modern repops. Just go out and find yourself a bit of old gnarled walnut and carefully make yourself another set that fit and slightly overlap the edges.

I'm of the old-time real Armourers school where what comes in the place only goes out perfect. Just like that bayonet would. It has absolutely no historical significance whatsoever, rare and valuable like that, it ain't - and those tatty old grips should be in the bin.

I hope others offer other opinions.

[browningautorifle]

I didn't notice that someone had ground a slice out of the side of the cross guard, taking a little wood off one grip in the process. The reason why anyone would consider it necessary to grind the side of the cross guard is a complete mystery.

Perhaps they were grinding off one of those filthy hooked quillions...

[Flying10uk]

Thanks Jim. That's the weird thing Jim, I should have really photographed the damage, the grinding was on the side of the cross guard. The worst of the damage was in-line with the damage that can be seen on the bottom grip on the right hand side, picture 1, post 1, where the grip is angled off. I can't work out how anyone could accidentally grind this or what reason there would be for deliberately doing so. I am pleased with the repaired cross guard which I have completed and re-blued this evening. I will post pictures later of this bayonet which has a blade in excellent condition.

Peter, why do yo say those grips are modern repros? I'm not suggesting that you are wrong but I was wondering how you could tell. I wondered why they weren't a great fit on the bayonet when I tried them for size this afternoon.

[CINDERS]

I can understand a car enthusiast wanting their vintage car to gleam like a 1000 suns and blind everyone including themselves as that is their passion besides who wants to ride around in a rust bucket that may be unsafe so we will chop the rust paint it up just like it left the factory that is fair enough my dad was the same when restoring cars for resale.

I feel the collectible military stuff should be left as it is preserving its history.

[browningautorifle]

the grinding was on the side of the cross guard.

It's impossible to assess exactly what someone along the way had in mind when he was working on it. Hard to say what was happening.

[tankhunter]

I'm of the old-time real Armourers school where what comes in the place only goes out perfect. Just like that bayonet would. It has absolutely no historical significance whatsoever, rare and valuable like that, it ain't - and those tatty old grips should be in the bin.

I hope others offer other opinions.

Pete, I like you. Would do exactly the same thing. I guess it is the ingrained training to just get on with a job that needs doing! Civilian Collector mentality is different to our way of thinking! I am not for one minute suggesting what they wold do is wrong at all. It's just not 'our' Way! Lol

There are many grips out on the collector circuits in the UK available. From many varied dealers. They are nearly all ex Australian war reserve stocks that were released when the rifles were. many years back now. You can easily spot these as they have the word 'Slazenger' stamped into the grip scales.
This is easily steamed out & rubbed down to make good. Not forgetting, that each pair of grips will in nearly all cases. NOT fit straight on the bayonet. But WILL require 'fitting'. In my opinion, this particular bayonet was so damaged as to become uninteresting to collectors as it was. Correctly profiled & restored, it now is more aesthetically pleasing to look at. AND has a higher value upon resale...Just my thoughts on this one.

having mused on this, but this particular Bayonet MAY have had the 'grinding' effected. To clear/ fit over 'something' when hung on a wall?

[Flying10uk]

I only thought of this option (3) today and that is to utilise some good 1907 grips currently, but incorrectly, fitted to a M1917 bayonet. I have been intending to either find some correct grips or make some with the double slots in the centre for this M1917 bayonet in any case. So it may be better to use what's on the M1917 on my 1907 bayonet and make or source the replacements for the M1917 because that needs them anyway. The 1907 would have good but Patinated grips.

Here are some pictures of the M1917 grips.

Any constructive thoughts appreciated, please.