Grumpy after attempting zeroing....

[spinecracker]

It also helps not to listen to Rap music when sighting in your rifles.
(it effects head movement)



Question, can you insert a feeler gauge between the rear of the fore stock and the receiver socket?



Also try removing the front trigger guard screw bushing and shoot the rifle without it, if the POI changes your Enfield is telling you something.



Remember the British are famous for keeping a stiff upper...................barrel

Wouldn't you know it? I have this amazing ability to find rifles with dodgy fore-ends :P

My latest purchase, a 1943 BSA No.4 Mk1, FTR'ed in 1949 (not upgraded to Mk. 1/2) has a gap on either side between the rear of the fore-end and the receiver socket that I can slide a bit of paper into (it was all I had to hand, haven't had time to buy feeler gauges, and it worked well enough to show me there was a problem), and the underside of the front of the barrel is pressing against the upper hand guard, not the fore-end. I haven't shot it yet. It looks like the fore-end had the angled draws replaced/repaired, probably during the FTR (it is a professional-looking job). I removed the front trigger guard screw bushing and reassembled and lo and hold! The front of the barrel is now contacting the front of the fore-end properly and is free of the upper hand guard, but the gap is still present between the rear of the fore-end and the receiver socket. I am researching my options (yes, I have found plenty of good information on this forum - boy, you guys know your stuff!), but on first glance it looks like I have to close the gap between the rear of the fore-end and the receiver socket, and that would appear to involve making modifications to the previously repaired angled draws. Next step would be to see how the changes affect the rest of the bedding points. I do not want to replace the fore-end as it is serial number-matched to the rifle. I have not shot this rifle yet, but I would like as many creases ironed out before I start blasting away. Comments would be appreciated before I make a pig's ear out of this

Edit - I just read Mr. Laidler's comments regarding fitting fore-ends, and it looks like I just need to trim down the front trigger guard screw bushing/collar a gnat's nadger, and that the gap between fore-end and the receiver socket may be aceptable ("If, after a days shooting, a gap between the rear of the fore-end and face of the butt socket opens up, up to .010”, then this is acceptable providing that there’s no noticeable play fore and aft (there won’t be if you’ve adjusted the collar correctly …) and the correct bearings at the reinforce, draws, magazine well sides and muzzle are intact. - "Fitting a fore-end correctly" by Peter Laidler, posted 5 Jan 2008 on "Replacing Wood Furniture on No4 MK2" thread).

[Buzzkill]

Please excuse the minor thread hi-jack:
I'm shooting a '42 LB No.4 with Federal 150 gr soft tips.
At 50 meters my POI is 3 to 5 inches high of my POA!
Normal?
I thought it might be due to the lighter load ( as opposed to 180 grains)
but, at 100 meters, things get very depressing indeed; almost the exact opposite happens.
POI is 3 to 5 inches lower of POA!
In both cases my 'groups', such as the are, are consistently to the right and rather loose at that!
The barrel seems to have the correct vertical play in the forestock/upper handgaurd but rests ever so slightly tighter to the left, or the right if you're looking down the barrel toward the trigger.
The trigger group screw is tight.
No feelers are getting in behind the action as pictured above.
Do I just stink?
Anyone?

[Edward Horton]

The Enfield Rifle has one action/bedding screw and other bolt action rifles have two action/bedding screws, the rear of the Enfield fore stock in the draws area acts as the second “missing” action screw.

If the bedding of the draws area is off or incorrect the barrel will not be centered in the barrel channel, the correct up pressure at the fore end tip will be off or incorrect and the Enfield will shoot larger groups.

With the forward trigger guard screw tight place a mark on either side of the slot in the screw head marking the trigger guard. Next remove the trigger guard bushing and reassemble the trigger guard and tighten the trigger guard screw, if the screw over turns or moves past your marks on the trigger guard the bushing is too long.

A bushing that is too long indicates wood shrinkage or wood crush or both, by simply re-oiling your stock it may re-hydrate and enlarge the wood.

Step one, shoot the Enfield with the bushing removed and “see” what happens to your POI and group size.

Step two, re-oil your stock with linseed oil.

Step three, read these books below, the maintenance instructions manual covers bedding.

1991 No.4 (All Marks) .303 Rifle Manuals (Complete Set) - Military Surplus Collectors Forums

This book covers sighting in your Enfield.

REME Precis No. SA/Rifles/3 (Zeroing of No.1, No.3, No.4, No.5 Rifles) - Military Surplus Collectors Forums

Bullet weight effects POI and the sights are set for 174 grain projectiles.

[Buzzkill]

Thanks Ed!

[Buzzkill]

Ed, there's actually THREE marks around the screw head!
Looks like this rifle's been through some!
My turn now, eh?
The screw slot does line up between the two 'dents' that are already there.
It's probably a little tighter than it was though.
I'll try the oiling and see how that goes.
As for the weight of the bullets, i had expected the POI to rise with a lighter weight. That's why I was confused about the lower POIs I was experiencing!

EDIT:
Whoops!
Seems it could be tightened more, like a quarter turn past the mark more.
Yikes.

[Edward Horton]

After you remove the trigger guard bushing and re-tighten remove the hand guards and check to see if the barrel is centered in the barrel channel. The rear draws area centers the barrel in the barrel channel so the pressure and contact area on both sides of the stock must be equal.

[Buzzkill]

Hi Ed,
the barrel actually seems to sit quite true in the stock.
I haven't had it out to the range since checking, so I don't know how it shoots without the bushing.
I do know that the screw tightens quite a bit past the marks with the bushing in place.
I've yet to re-oil the stock but I hope that's all it will take. The bedding instructions in the manual you linked to are a bit intimidating for a rookie like me!
Is there some simpler fix?
Thanks again for your help!

[Edward Horton]

Buzzkill

In the manuals I have if the fore stock had over .020 “wood crush” combined below the receiver and below the trigger guard the fore stock was to be replaced. (.010 top and bottom) Some Enfield's have not had the stocks re-oiled in over 50 years and the stocks are suffering from wood shrinkage.

We have to learn to make do with the stock we have and make up its “short comings”, in most cases this means “adding” to the stock and NOT removing any wood. (Shimming)

You can learn a lot by giving your barrel and receiver a good oiling, reattach your fore stock and then remove it looking for oily areas on the wood. If the oily areas match the bedding diagrams then just shorten the trigger guard bushing and keep your stock oiled with RAW linseed oil.

Don't worry about being a rookie, when I got my first Enfield I sat staring at it for days wondering why the bolt wasn't on the left hand side of the receiver.
(The Brits shift with their left hand)

P.S. You wont go blind if you play with your fore stock, experiment with placing different thickness paper shims in different areas.

Permanent paper shims can be added and held in place with varnish and sanded to the correct thickness, if your in a hurry super glue also works and is what I use most of the time.

[FugWit2]

For those wearing glasses a tip that works for me.
Tie a short, fairly thin cord, or ribbon to the top of the bridge piece of the glasses frame. Then loop this either into the brim of a hat, ot thru a headband if it's hot. By adjusting the band/hat & loop of the ribbon, you can get your glasses to stay perfectly in place even on the hottest, sweatiest days. It lets the frame hang from something instead of trying to slide down your nose.

[MJ1]

I have never shot the 303 at a 25 yard target. I do remember getting a rough 200 yard zero on graph paper with the M14. After that training was simplicity it self. Use balls, belly and eyeballs for ranging. Or low, center and high equals 100 200 and 300 yards. It's must be similar for 303 if the rifle is all correct.

What we didn't know could fill a book or more.