Citadel M1-22 Carbine

[Sentryduty]

Another item of note with this design, wear your eye protection, I know everyone here always practices firearms safety 100% of the time, but this situation is a bit more specific.

This little rifle often spits hot powder fragments back at the shooter, occasionally during firing I noticed bits were hitting my face and landing in my hair, a minor nuisance, but without shooting glasses it would not be much of a stretch for some of this debris to find an eye.

Running this blowback gun isn't much different than any other aside from the open topped breech, many semi-auto .22 LR actions have a top and eject to the side, which would eliminate this problem, but this design allows particles to spray towards the shooter's face.

Just something from my notebook that I forgot during my post last evening.

[browningautorifle]

Good info, we'll be watching.

[Sentryduty]

I gave the rifle a detailed strip and cleaning this weekend and fully stripped the trigger group.

It is interesting, a mix of plastic, aluminium, and steel. All friction points were covered in a dab of what appeared to be a di-electric or silicone style grease, including hammer hook and sear. Their application of grease is somewhat curious as lubricated trigger components tend to act inconsistently.

Despite all of the grease, there were aluminium shavings in the bottom of the trigger pack, I assume due to new rifle break in, which the round count is currently at 200.

The steel parts are well made, and are generally free from burrs or rough edges, however the aluminium parts feature casting flash and generally have a mold line that inhibits a smooth trigger. None of the plastic parts have any responsibility for releasing the shot, but there are a couple of places where steel is bearing on aluminium, so that is an interesting point that may effect long term durability of this design.

Testing the trigger with a Lyman digital gauge seen an average of 8lb 8oz.

I will do a detailed photo series and some very careful polish work to see what can be done to improve this trigger without clipping springs or impacting safety. Personally I would love to have a 5-6 lbs trigger that has a smooth travel. While shooting at the range, there was an odd thing with the reset, if the trigger was only relaxed enough to just release the disconnector, the subsequent pull would be noticeably harder/crunchy, so that is something to investigate.

Coming from a background in military and service grade triggers I don't need a 2lb match trigger with no overtravel in every gun, but a gritty, heavy, 8+lb trigger is just unpleasant.

More to follow as time permits.

[Seaspriter]

Guess I couldn't resist showing another option to the M1 Citadel.

The top one is a Marlin M2 989 from the mid sixties with its original Weaver B6 scope. The bottom one is a Marlin 995 from the early 1980s. I replaced the stock sights with Tech target sights that are close to the M1 Carbine. They shoot quite nicely and can be purchased in very good condition from $160-200 USD. These are a real value in today's market.

To confess, I did some woodworking on the fore end to cure the bluntness of the original and removed the Monte Carlo comb so the stock profiles would match the real M1 Carbine.

Some have very finely grained walnut stocks as you can see.

[Sentryduty]

Nice collection, and the design influences are quite plain in the side by side. I had always thought the most obvious "copy" was Bill Ruger's line of the 10/22 and Mini-14 series, a fellow doesn't even have to squint much to see the re-semblance.

I had considered a Modern Mini-14 in lieu of a non-restricted M1 carbine 30.cal if I couldn't find one, but they just don't have the same panache. That, and I have fired a modern one with the accuracy improvements that was mounted with an optic and very good handloads, it ran well but the accuracy was not what I would expect for the price point. Total investment of about $1500 plus moly coated handloads, and rough accuracy was 3-4 MOA @ 200 yards.

It sure didn't have that "pointability" of the original M1 Carbine either, the balance and weight were just a little "off".

[Seaspriter]

have that "pointability" of the original M1 Carbine either, the balance and weight were just a little "off".

Interestingly the Marlin and the M1 Carbine
- weigh exactly the same unloaded: 5 1/4 lbs (without magazine)
- have the exact same balance point
- feel nearly the same (Marlin is a little more slender)
- come on target the same
- are semi-automatic rapid fire (Marlin does take a 15 rnd mag)

What I like is the beauty of the Marlin -- she mounts well on my wall with a slender grace that distinguishes her as a thoroughbred. With simple blow-back, she's not a knockoff nor an imitation, just kin with the M1

[Sentryduty]

I had my Inland and Chiappa Carbines laying side by side last night and thought the proportions looked a little off, so I grabbed a tape measure to compare.

My USGI Carbine is modified with a longer 20.5" barrel so it makes sense why it looks a tad long, but the Chiappa looked very short for some reason, and I have figured out why.

The Chiappa has an 18" barrel when measured from breech face to muzzle crown, no surprises there, but due to the way they set the chamber back into the design, the .22LR chamber occupies the same place the the .30 cal bolt head and locking lugs would. If measured from the casting mark that would represent the .30 cal chamber the barrel is only 17" long. So the overall result is a slight "bullpup effect" the rifle has a full 18" barrel, but due to the setback drops 1" from the barrel protrusion from the stock and overall length giving the same appearance that a .30 cal gun would have if the barrel had been chopped back to 17". Chiappa could have resolved this visual error by fitting the gun with a 19" barrel, it would have maintained proper carbine visuals and sight radius, while providing the customer with an additional bit of velocity.

I may try to grab a photo this evening, but I was glad to realize that I wasn't going crazy, the Chiappa just seemed a little disproportionate compared to photos of unaltered M1 Carbines.

Does it have any negative effect on shooting or handling? No certainly not, but it may change the outlook of anyone looking for a "perfect" sub-caliber Carbine replica.

[Sentryduty]

[gunsdora]

I spotted this stock 10/22 M1 carbine . Thought I would give it a try. And pick up the Tec sight 200 to go with it. Just need the 10/22 rifle. Was also thinking of the chippa but was told it had too much plastic parts ???.

[Sentryduty]

Was also thinking of the chippa but was told it had too much plastic parts ???.

There is a lot of plastic parts in the Chiappa.

Plastic
Trigger group
Sights
Band/Swivel
Magazines
Recoil Plate

Steel Parts

Barrel
Bolt
Springs
Butt plate
Guide rod
Screws/Pins
Hammer and fire group

Non-Steel Metal Parts

Receiver
Slide
Trigger and some fire group small parts

Other

Stock - Wood

The plastic isn't as nice as metal fittings would be, however it does appear durable enough to work as intended. Modern plastics have continued to improve, and in the case of stuff like Glocks have taken over a large part of the firearms construction without issue. I don't know if this gun is build to the same level as a Glock plastic, but who knows?

That Ruger 10/22 Stock is a very nice piece, hopefully you can find a nice, older production 10/22 to drop in there, I think a new gun might contrast too much against the fine stock and grey fittings. I enjoy modern firearms as working tools, but wood and steel guns have a life and character all of their own.