Informational post on Gibbs 1903 a4

[jdmcomp]

Yeah, I know, farb. However, I wanted to shoot a 1903a4 and I would not nor could not afford an original. I do shoot a lot of replicas and save my originals for future collectors. So we got that out of the way. (see my periscope rifle post in the Enfields section for other replicas)

The scope mounted on the rifle was broken from the start. Gibbs folk sent me a new one and a shipping label for the old one. Good folk. The owners manual and all reviews of the rifle point out that the Asian contractor got the windage and elevation backwards. However the new scope does not have that problem. And with much luck, after mounting it, I needed only a couple of clicks each way to meet my laser boresighter. Too cold to shoot right now so range will have to wait. BTW the old scope was shiny blue and the new dull blue.

Overall the rifle is what you would expect. Needed a bit of touching up here and there and tightening of all screws (all were very loose). Action binds a bit on the extractor but that is to be corrected soon. New stock which was not fitted as should be. Except for the bolt, all parts got parking. Like a late war rebuild. I find rubbing lanolin into the park helps darken it somewhat as the oil ages. I cannot see the serial number but Gibbs assures me that it is under the scope mount. The actions are drill rifle salvage. Like all rifles of this ilk, that is assembled by the mad beavers, cleaning out of all the debris of the assembly shop is the first action and takes care of a lot of problems.

Accessories such as sling and carry case are typical cheap Asian copies and mostly show and no go. Gibbs should change this. Further, the rifles sent out for review by gun writers seem to be better made and have more details then mine, such as the stock cartouches (check out the review in Surplus Firearms Magazine). I do not think the writers are dishonest, but they do like the special deals they get from the companies they review.

Overall, this would be a great rifle for re-enactors to use and save the originals for collectors. Also a great rifle for shooters who want the experience and can share it with fellow shooters without worrying about a pristine safe queen.

As a PS, let me say that I see two groups of collectors, one the Canfield types who only want unissued/unshoot perfect examples the other, like me, that see the honest scars of use as a badge of honor to be respected. In either case, providing the experience of shooting these heros of history is also important. (So many military I know have never experienced the fun of the recoil of a 30'06 straight stock 03 in the rapid fire of a DCM match.)

Information

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[ironbrigade]

good post.
i was looking at possibly getting one of these, but think i just changed my mind. yet as stated, more for some one who wants to shoot/experience the
A4.

[Skip]

My last contact (30Nov) with Gibbs was that the scopes adjustments were still reversed. I asked when they would be corrected and they replied:

"NO and it appears it will not be resolved any time soon".

Here is the price.

Yes they are available Complete set $179.95, just the rings $49.95 Just
the scope $149.95 plus shipping and handling.

I desperately need a scope on my A4. My commercial scope doesn't look right.

[jdmcomp]

This is a cheap Chin scope, which I suspect will not hold up too well. It is the type you see from NStar for $35 at the gun shows. I suspect that if you watch you will see them there soon enough. I would wait.

[Chuckindenver]

did they tell you that they are recovered drill rifles?????
Gibbs is Navy Arms..

[jdmcomp]

I have not questioned Gibbs as to the drill rifle issue. However, the receiver shows tell-tale work where drill rifles are spot welded. Others have reported similar findings and Gibbs does not deny. Guns and Ammo's Surplus Firearms magazine uses the phrase "dewatted training rifles". Come to your own conclusion. On this basis I describe them as drill rifles.

And yes, Gibbs as well as Old West Scrounger, are part of Navy arms. I somehow think the senior VF would have put out a better product, or at least I think he did in his day. And remember I am reporting on a single example in hand and pictures published elsewhere. Maybe holding Gibbs to the standard of a wartime production Remington is unfair, but I think not. And the work is nowhere near the level of my Springfield 03.

I did know somewhat what I was buying (a replica) but I do express some disappointment in the apparent differences between those rifles sent to reviewers and those sold to the public. This may not have been intentional yet it remains a fact.

All that said, I do credit Gibbs with not attempting to replicate the rifle so as to fool the uneducated. Placing credit for the scope and the barrel squarely where it belongs is the right thing to do. We have enough fakes floating around as it is. The Gibbs is not a fake, but a replica. I believe the rifle safe to fire although fit and finish could have been better.

[45B20]

Jdmcom

A straight up review, without any BS, thank you. Have you slugged the bore?? I am curious as how well the barrel is made??

As to the scope, I my opinion the original was not all that great, way back when, when they were floating around and relatively cheap,, I would only put them on 22s. Do you think this knock-off is that much inferior???

Let us know when you get to test fire the Rifle.

45B20

[jdmcomp]

No, I have not slugged the bore and think it quite unnecessary. Pedersoli has been making barrels for more then 50 years and does a very good job. This rifle was not nor will never be, except by chance, an extremely accurate rifle. It simply has not been assembled with the care necessary.

But then neither was the original {an extremely accurate rifle} for that matter. Today we accept sub MOA as the standard. In 1942 this was not the expectation. Military ammo alone had a 4 MOA allowance as I remember. Pre-war Springfield built rifles are real beauties for military rifles but the war time production rifles were more valued for their sheer numbers then their fine finish.

As for the scope, I was not comparing it to the original, but rather to the range of scopes available in todays market. It was after all in response to someones question about purchasing a replica scope from Gibbs at what I think is too high a price. You are correct in stating that the scopes available in 1942 are not at the lowest quality of scopes in the mainstream today. But this is an Asian knockoff and since the first one arrived with the crosshairs flailing loosely inside the tube I do not think my review of the scope was off.

(regrets sent)

[Calif-Steve]

jdmcomp:I think he was actually thanking you for a straight up review. Not a snide comment. One thing does bother me about the magazine review. They had a real 03-A4 AND a replica rifle in the article. I could not figure out which the article was talking about. More then just a little confusing. Calling a drill rifle a "dewatted training rifle" tells me what? I thought dewats were machine guns. I would like to see some photos of a customer's rifle. Would someone post some photos? Thanks guys.

[Chuckindenver]

demil, or dewat as per ATF standards...cut into 3 parts..
modified for Drill use, per military standards.
plug the bore with a carbon steel rod. cut a notch through the chamber welding said rod to the chamber.
weld barrel to the reciever.
grind striker point off. weld striker hole on the end of the bolt body.
install bolt,,
weld cutoff lever in the down setting, so the bolt cant be removed, and the bolt will still function, remove or grind the front sight blade off.
most if not all DP rifles were loaned to the ROTC program.
returned as they were replaced with NONGUNS made by Daisy, as the school systems now have a no weapons policy. thanks to the Libs, and feel good laws passed.
trying to avoid Colombine type shootings yada yada yada.