1st MAS 36 rifle

[Anzac15]

Yep. Thought Algeria was a possibility. I've looked up slings for every French rifle since WW2, and I'll be damned if I can't find a match. I shall definitely try 'bretelle'...maybe that will be the clincher!

[Anzac15]

Well, found ONE match under 'bretelle'....it was pictured with a MAS 45 .22 trainer. But the rifle it was with had another sling with it, sooooo......
Found a pic, but not dead cert it's for a 45.

[jmoore]

I'm not saying you didn't look hard, but "bretelle MAT 49" produced a bunch of useful images straight off the bat using Bing! search thingie on "my internets". First image for instance:

[Aragorn243]

The two types of ammo are 1924C which is light ball for rifles and 1924D which is heavy ball for machine guns.

I can find no performance data for the 1924D but reloading data for heavier bullets show quite an improvement over the performance of the 1924C factory load so it appears the 1924C loading is well under the max for these rifles. Pressure for the 1924C is 40,000 at the breech according to "Cartridges of the World" by Frank Barnes. The 1924C uses a 140 grain bullet.

Lots of fellows are apparently using the 1924D with good results.

[Anzac15]

Good to hear on the ammo. Will be picking some up at the local gun show this weekend.
Sling appears definitely to be for a MAS 45 trainer. Found a French manual online that goes into a bit of detail on how to use it. It's referred to as a 'bretelle de tir'.
Now if I'd only stayed awake in those French classes....

[jmoore]

Now I'm confused. Sling went from MAT 49 to "MAS 49" and now it's MAS 45?

[Patrick Chadwick]

MAS = Manufacture d'Armes de St. Etienne
MAT = Manufacture d'Armes de Tulle

MAS36 = rifle
MAT49 = submachine gun
MAS49 = French slr
MAS45 = training rifle, made in part by Mauser under French supervision (somebody please check that)

And, of course, like the M1907 sling, the same basic sling could be used for several different types of rifle.

[jmoore]

The weapons were known- the sling application: Not!

So it's OK for all of the above?

And, yes, the MAS 45 was a Mauser product. Produced in a French factory, IIRC. There are even some with the Mauser banner. Supposed to be rare that way, but a friend picked one out of a crate years ago when they were imported in "large" numbers.

[Anzac15]

Yep, last MAS 45 I saw did indeed have a Mauser banner.

[Patrick Chadwick]

The weapons were known ...

OK, I wasn't sure exactly where the confusion lay.

.., the sling application: Not! So it's OK for all of the above?

That is not quite what I said. Bear with me for a moment, and look at these pics:

MAT49
http://www.naturabuy.fr/MAT-49-type-...em-480973.html
and here's another

http://www.naturabuy.fr/AK-47-Neutra...em-833698.html
and another

http://www.esistoire.fr/produit/MAT4...eutralise.html
This appears to be the type of sling that started the thread. The 3rd pic is probably the clearest, but I included the others to point out that it is not a one-off. Note the swivel attachment is different from a MAS36 or MAS49 (we'll come to them in a moment). It appears to be a wire twist loop combined with a snaphook fastener.

Now please look at this:
http://www.aassniper98.com/index.php?choix=11417
It is the same sling leather, but without the attachment. You can find plent of these by entering "MAS49 bretelle". And they are all offered without the fastener. And look to me just like the previous ones, as far as the leather is concerned.
The ring-formed sling loop I mentioned in a previous post is apparently considered to be a part of the rifle, not the sling, as I have not yet found a MAS sling offered that includes this ring.
The leather sling appears to be the same for the entire MAS family (36, 36/51, 49, 49/56).
And the difference to the MAT49 (or 49/54) APPEARS to be just this fixing, not the leather sling.

I.e. Same sling leather (at least, I have not yet spotted the difference), but a different sling loop (which seems to be regarded as part of the gun, at least for the MAS rifles).

Concluding a story that has become longer than I intended, Anzac15 needs the front sling loop - a MAS rifle part , not a sling part.
And then he can use the sling he already has, removing the wire twist loop and looping the leather through the loop that is part of the rifle.

That is how it seems to me, but you can search the internet and draw your own conclusions.


Patrick