No4t Cocking pieces, which is best.

[Beerhunter]

Trying to chamber a round with the tips of three fingers pushing on the bolt handle and ending up with your index finger on one side of the cocking piece and the rest on the other side, rather than all four fingers and the thumb in the n I'd like to see a demonstration of the advantages thereof as opposed to just sliding the hand around the but wrist slightly to use the thumb.

Where did that come from? I was describing applying the safety, noting to do with chambering a round?

[Lee Enfield]

And me BAR. Sounds a bit cack handed to me, especially when the left thumb, that MUST be redundant on the butt if you want to apply the safety, is only a gnats knacker away!

The question of the half cock has always been a bit contentious as some insist that it is an APPLIED safety. NOT SO......... It is an inbuilt MECHANICAL SAFETY.

However, as I am sure Gil will agree, there was an unwritten tacit agreement during 'the troubles' that the Browning pistol could be carried loaded and ready (one in the chamber) but instead of the applied safety, to put the hammer into the half cock position. You can't apply the safety there. It being easier to get your pistol and fully cock it is easier than using the small safety lever. But like all these tacit agreements, it was all very well but come the accident and subsequent Court of Enquiry, it wouldn't wash. THen it was by the book or nothing.

With a Browning High Power/ M.35/No2MkI* you certainly can apply the safety lever with the hammer at the half cocking position.

I do it all the time at the range, with my Inglis No2MkI* and the FN Browning I used to have.

[Peter Laidler]

Ok Lee Enfield, I stand corrected there. Didn't have one handy while I was writing it but just used the sectioned drawing to see what was what. But you get my drift re the half cock........

Anyone else care to add to that either way?

[Brian Dick]

It's the 1911/1911A1 that the safety cannot be applied at half cock. Since i have legally carried both types of pistol for self defense, I think the only way to carry either the Colt or Browning is with the hammer fully cocked and the safety applied. Practice makes perfect drawing, lowering the safety catch and firing. To lower the safety, full cock and fire would be a bit much IMHO.

[Bruce_in_Oz]

Reference for "On with fore-finger, off with thumb" on No1 rifles, (at least in Oz service):

Small Arms Training
Vol 1 Pamphlet 3
Rifle
1943
Australia
Page 6
Para 2.i

"Push forward Safety Catch (sic) with thumb of right hand.

Para 2.ix

"......and apply safety catch with forefinger and with remaining fingers ensure that bolt lever is fully down."

See here: http://www.weapons.org.uk/index.htm for a copy.

Of the many things learned in five years of training with the Air Training Corps RAAF, (Cadets), some of it has stuck, even after forty years.

[Surpmil]

Where did that come from? I was describing applying the safety, noting to do with chambering a round?

.... As the index finger of the right hand is applying the safety, the remaining three fingers brush the bolt handle down....

The part about "brush the bolt handle down" implied movement to me, so I carried it to what seemed the logical conclusion. I see what you meant now.

[jmoore]

Ok Lee Enfield, I stand corrected there. Didn't have one handy while I was writing it but just used the sectioned drawing to see what was what. But you get my drift re the half cock........

Anyone else care to add to that either way?

My take is that carrying either a HP or 1911 variant at half cock and loaded chamber is the second least safe way to carry one. The next being at full cock and safety off. If the hammer's fully down the inertial firing pin can't be jarred forward. Have tried it. beat a hammer down pistol with a ball pein until the pistol's hammer fractured in two. No discharge...But well OT, so back to L-Es.