M1A Kaboom

[hagar in SC]

I had an out of battery incident with my NM AR rifle. I was having problems with my reloads chambering, and thinking that I sized them wrong, used some new factory (not reloaded seconds) ammo. On the second shot the case head blew, got a big puff of gas in the face, and the rifle was locked up solid. We (it was a team effort) managed to get the bolt open by repeatedly banging the buttstock on the grass, and only the extractor was damaged(bent). My theory is that I had a piece of "something" (either a piece of a cleaning patch, or a piece of grass) stuck in the chamber, and that is why my reloads would not chamber. Replaced the extractor and it ran fine. Even a case head separation would not cause this with a regular load of powder, but an overload can blow the rear of the case off and cause damage.

My best guess is that either it was an overload, or the bolt was not fully in battery because the case was not sized properly.

[Gun Surfer]

SA concluded it was a hot round. They agreed to send him and M21 upgrade for $400 bucks more. He has no beef with SA. He (and I) would like to know if an out of battery malfunction firing (not a slam fire) is even possible. I think it very hard to do with the M1 & M1A designs, but don't know much about that and hope never to test it with a live round.

Although I think you get it, just for the record I'll restate that it was "factory remanufactured" ammo, not a home reload. Owner said he thinks it is very hard to overcharge a .308. I certainly think it is possible to overcharge a
.308 case, although I have never tried it and do not intend to do what some of those young guys in the previous stories did :-). It is harder to do than in a large volume round like 30-06.

If he still has the blown case, I will get it an post better pics later. He has all the original ammo from that lot and has no intention of shooting it. When I get them, I will check that stuff out with some "non-destructive" measurements just for the heck of it. I would think that if there was some kind of incipient head separation prior to firing, the case might still have some indications of that, although with a LC case, would think that to be less likely.

This just gives one pause and reinforces the need for caution, and its closer to home when you find out it happened to someone you know with the same kind of rifle you own. I reload all my M1A ammo other than some high quality Aussie mil surplus occasionally, and follow some pretty rigorous safety procedures. I had at one time been on a quest on how to make brass cases last as long as possible, in future I'll just limit the number of reloads of my brass to a reasonable number and call it good :-)

[RED]

I had a compleate case head separation on a 5.56 round fired full auto in a M-16. It was one of my own reloads and was caused by the case's shoulder having been set back too far. The OAL was correct but the Dillon 1200 auto trim die was set too far in and was creating a head space problem. Fortunately for me the next round did not fire out of battery. I quickly decided to no longer shoot reloads or remans in my expensive NFA registered guns. Nowadays even SA M1A's fall into that category! Saving a few cents per round just isn't worth the risk.

[John Kepler]

He has no beef with SA. He (and I) would like to know if an out of battery malfunction firing (not a slam fire) is even possible.

Yes....yes it is, particularly with a Springfield Armory M1A cast receiver (he may have more of a beef with SA than he is aware of!). SA has had a chronic problem consistently getting the firing-pin retraction bridge located exactly in their raw castings. In their defense, to fully function, that bridge has to be in EXACTLY the right location....+- nothing, for the safety bridge to fully and completely function. If its off even a touch (and many are), the firing pin can extend far enough out-of-battery to light the primer. 99.99% of the time, any slight mislocation of the bridge doesn't cause the slightest trouble....then there's that 0.01%!

[dgrimm]

Here is a similar story with a professional examination by Clint McKee

http://www.thegunzone.com/m1akb.html

[five 0]

Gun Surfer
Was the remanufactured ammo by Ultra Max?

[wd0bcx]

According to the Springfield Armory's own documentation " the use of reloaded or remanufactured ammunition VOIDS the guarantee...".

Given that your friend used "Cabela's factory remanufactured .308 ammo" HE HAS NO RECOURSE through Springfield.

The manufactures have specific do's and don't clauses in their warranties for a reason.

Sounds like Springfield was VERY generous in their offer of a repair and or upgrade of the rifle for a fee.

They could have said "you are S O L, now go away!"

Glad your friend was not hurt.

[slamfire1]

The picture of the case is indistinct. I see rim edges, so I am going to assume that part of the case head came off.

The damage I see is consistent with a gas leak in an unsupported area of the case.

I have seen .223 cases that the rim tore off (but not completely) and blew the magazine out of the rifle.

The .223 cases were surplus brass from Scharch. A fellow shooter who had also purchased Scharch .223 brass examined the case I brought from the line. He said the rupture through the case head was similiar to brass failures he had.

(and this will blow your minds, it happened to two AR15 on the same 300 rapid fire relay. The rifles and ammunition were provided by a club member to two new shooters. Each rifle fed the next round into chamber, even though the magazines were blown out of each rifle. And the fellow who previously had failures with Scharch brass, he had experienced the same phenoma)

[BottleBaby]

You just don't know what that once-fired brass was fired out of or how long it sat on the ground before someone picked it up. Sometimes you don't know if it is even really only once fired. It could be someone's cast off junk that somebody else picked up and sold.

[Gun Surfer]

Hey Five O, you are psychic. The ammo that blew the gun was NOT Ultra Max. However, my friend has some boxes of Ultra Max .308 in 165gr. He has recently asked me if it is ok to shoot it in an M1A. What say you?

Mr. Kepler: So an out of battery fire overcoming the M1A design is possible. Is this bridge out of place issue the only way in which this could happen?

wd0bcx: I hear what you are saying, I read the mfg literature too. However, I have as much or more confidence in my reloads than most factory ammo. As I said my qc process is pretty thorough. Reloading is worth the risk for me, the risk is calculated and low, but never taking anything for granted and always learning.

After reading thus far, I am leaning toward a failed case / an overloaded case.

I dont use rifle "range brass", and after reading all these posts, wont ever bother picking up any rifle brass unless its my own!

Thanks all for your responses thus far.