Restamped bolt!??

[31pickemup]

Hello all
I pickem up a 1942 Byf at a local show today. It has no import marks and has not been reblued. The stock has to be a RC as there is a four digit number stamped into the butt stock. The other things that are weird are the bands. They have the last two serials stamped into it but no waffenapts. Also the bolt has the original finish but has been restamped over the other numbers. Did the Germans ever do this? Ill get some pictures of it on later. The rifle looks great and has a original cleaning rod in it. I didn't pay a whole lot for it. But I like to learn about these things so I can get better at identifying.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Badger]

Pics would definitely help ...

Thanks ..

Regards,
Badger

[31pickemup]

Ok pics posted. Probably will use it as a reenacting gun.

[kar98k]

may not have been an RC. may have been another country that captured it (also may have been humped by somebody trying to make it more authentic). the Germans never stamped their serial number on that location on the bands.

[Badger]

We'll, if you refer to any library entry for a K98k in the Germany - Milsurp Knowledge Library (click here), with thanks to Advisory Panel member Claven2, youl'll find an excellent article under each Collectors Comments and Feedback section which addresses that question.

I've copied one here for your reference.

2. CAUTION: How do I tell if I have a rebuilt RC (Russian Capture) and not an original unaltered K98k?

Russian Capture K98k's all share similar traits. The are all WW2 era German Karabiners (though some are former Gew98's the Nazis had converted to K98k spec - rare though!). Most have matching receiver and barrel.

When the Russians came into these guns they stockpiled them and promptly began doing other more important things like rebuilding their cities, etc. Many RC rifles sat for month or even years exposed to the elements. By the late 1940's, many of these rifles were in an advanced state of deterioration, while some remained like new.

In true Russian style, a colossal public make-work project was undertaken. The ENTIRE inventory of German small arms then in Russian possession (roughly half the total wartime output of Nazi Germany's arms production) was ordered to undergo refurbishment and as many useable arms as possible to be made ready. Why? Russia was paranoid. The Cold War was freezing over and Russia feared invasion from the West. Also, it was a cheap source of arms they could export to allies in North Korea, Cuba, Vietnam, and every other wanna-be commi armpit of the world without depleting their "front line" weapons stockpiles.

The Russians took all their K98k's, and totally disassembled them except for the barrel. Bores were inspected and those found to be acceptable (ie, some pitting OK - so long as it's still safely shootable, much like with their refurbed Mosins) were set aside. Those that were deemed too far gone were recycled into steel for tractor parts or Order of Lennin medals, or whatever.

The small parts were all hot-dip reblued. Rusty parts were wire brushed or sandblasted first. These were placed indiscriminately in bins. The stocks were also inspected for serviceability. Those deemed acceptable were retained, those unacceptable were burned.

When the rifles were re-assembled no effort was made to match parts. A new (used) bolt was assembled and fitted to the receiver and the whole affair was assembled into a rifle from the binned parts. When done, most parts were electropencilled with the rifle's serial number and a flat was sanded on the left side of the wood stock (think big belt sander and half-drunk worker). The rifle's serial number was stamped there running parallel to the rifle's bore line. (Yugos are stamped perpendicular, for comparison)

Once complete, the whole rifle was generally painted in cheap shellac as a preservative agent - these are often not cosmolened for some reason - crated up and sent to war reserve, especially in the frontier states like Ukraine (which stored them in underground "nuclear proof" depleted salt mines). Today, cash strapped former Soviet states are all too happy to sell these to us.

It's difficult to say what percentage of captured arms survived the rebuild programs, but I'd imagine maybe half (or less) would be a good guess. Many of these arms sat out in the open for LONG periods of time before being rebuilt, so attrition due to the elements was probably a factor.

It's also wrong to assume that RC's are, in fact, "captures". At any given moment, less than 2 million Nazi troops would have served on the Russian front. Not all would have had K98K's. Over 14 Million K98k's were built and most experts agree that somewhere around 7 million likely ended up in Russian hands after the war. Throughout the whole war, it's doubtful a full 7 million K98k's traveled to east Prussia and beyond.

When Nazi Germany surrendered to the Allies, the Whermacht assembled at depots all over Europe and turned in their arms. Additionally, government arms stockpiles and factories were captured and divied up by the victorious armies. At hostilities cessation, every Mauser weapon in the future East Germany (and all points east) would have become what we think of as an "RC K98k". Public ownership of guns in the USSR was banned as well. So whether a rifle was taken from a dead private in 1944 Minsk or if the NKVD knocked on a door in Berlin in 1947 and confiscated the arm from a retired volkspolitzei prison guard, it still ended up in the stocks of RC mausers. In fact, it's safe to say the MAJORITY of such guns are likely NOT battlefield captures. ...... (Feedback by "Claven2")

Regards,
Badger

[Calif-Steve]

I have a CE Mod98 that was rebuilt at DOT just prior to the war's end. They did grind off the CE marking and re-stamped the rifle the old stamps remain visible. I would guess the rifle in question ended up in the Dutch/Luxumburg Army. Not a German rebuild.

[Sarge]

Your rifle has a Jugoslav stock. I don't see any over stamp on bolt nrs.
Neither the Jugoslavs or ruskies stamped nrs on top of nrs. The nrs on the bbl band you show are not German, maby Jugoslav?
I would expect that it is one of the Jugoslavs imported before the RCs came into the country - maby 15+ yrs ago. Many of those were almost matching rifles.
Sarge

[bearhunter]

It certainly looks like the Yugoslav Mauser I have. I don't know if I agree with the premise that Yugoslavia didn't re stamp numbers though. I have one that the bold has obviously been re stamped, on the side of the bolt handle. The rest of the numbers on the bolt, match the receiver and stock. Mine has the Yugo crest on top of the receiver. The Czech stamps have been ground away and replaced with Cyrillic letters and numbers instead. Your receiver is clean and looks to be in original condition. Are there any Cyrillic stamps on the left side?

[hoosier8]

Definetly a restamped bolt. Here is a pic I found of a BYF42 that has not been restamped. The giveaway is the bolt handle surface has been ground down and the raised plateau is not there anymore, plus the fonts are wrong.

Since it is in a RC stock, i would guess that someone here did it to try to fool the unsuspecting. K98's are kind of getting to be a minefield if you do not know what to look for.

Looks like a nice gun and I hope it shoots well. Enjoy it.