The WWII No4(T) and No32 timeliines

[Surpmil]

Here's an interesting photo. It shows what I assume is the original label inside a No8 scope case. The rifle number is 0C2116 and the scope number is 1852, which would be a 1942 W.Watson No32 MkI.

Now, at the bottom of the paper label is the "printer's notes" if you will, which seems to include an order date of 4/43. I've seen similar notes on various other documents and papers and they often include the number printed in that particular order etc.

Can we therefore conclude that this early Savage No4(T) was set up with its equally early No32 some time after March 1943? That seems a bit late for what we think is the No4(T) "timeline" does it not?

I've probably got photos of this same label in other cases, but if members here have examples it might be worth having a closer look at them.

This Case No8 turned up in Hungary by the way and looks to be un-altered since WWII.

Photo won't upload despite being only about 100Kb. Will try tomorrow.

Moderator Edit: Emailed photo added to post for member ....

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[Roger Payne]

That's an interesting observation Rob. I suppose it's also possible that the labels were not immediately available on completion of the sniping equipment & were added at a (shortly) later date as they became available; though I really have no idea - pure speculation! Maybe Peter will know? I'll certainly have a look through my scope tins to see what I've got.

ATB

[Peter Laidler]

I think that Roger is right there. I don't think that the first tins didn't have a label as I have VERY early telescope 1077 (the 77th production tele, the earliest that I have ever seen and know of - unless anyone out there knows different) in the box and there was never a label in the tin. Later, instructions were issued to quartermasters under the 'small arms instructions' that went to unit QM's that described these instructions and how they should be affixed. With gum, arabic incidentally and pasted over afterwards as well!

So it could be that the labels were introduced later.

I mentioned a couyple of years ago that many of the No4T rifles were dropped to partisan groups. I had/saw one with a label written in cyrillic script dated 1944. It simply said something like 'the telescope must stay with the same rifle.....' or words to that effect!

[Surpmil]

Thanks for those replies; it does all hinge on whether they were applied 'from new', so if they weren't then that's that!

So initially Peter, the only marking that connected the scope, rifle, bracket and case to each other from a QM point of view was the serial number of the scope stamped into the butt of the rifle and rifle number on the tongue of the butt? One can see how that might 'cause a little confusion' as the Pythons put it.

Interesting about the partisan groups, perhaps this explains why No32s have shown up in places like Poland or this Case No.8 in Hungary.

Must be quite a few stashed away on the Continent even now.

(Photo won't upload today either. Badger, any clues? It just brings up a small exclamation mark in the top bar of the upload window. It's a .jpg file about 100Kbs.)

[Badger]

(Photo won't upload today either. Badger, any clues? It just brings up a small exclamation mark in the top bar of the upload window. It's a .jpg file about 100Kbs.)

Shouldn't be a problem unless there's a virus or something else embedded in the pic ...

Email it to me at badger@milsurps.com and I'll check and post it for you ..

Regards,
Doug

[Surpmil]

Shouldn't be a problem unless there's a virus or something else embedded in the pic ...

Email it to me at badger@milsurps.com and I'll check and post it for you ..

Regards,
Doug

Cheers, I'll scan it with a couple of programs myself now, before sending it.

This is the listing anyway:

British Lee Enfield Sniper Rifle Scope Case | eBay