"Flying" Jacket And Goggles.

[Flying10uk]

Not long after WW2, in the late 1940's, my father wanted a jacket and some goggles to wear while riding his motorcycle, a 1946 350cc OHV AJS. The place to go then, especially if you had a limited budget, as most people did at that time in the UK was the local government surplus store, rather than a motorcycle shop.

My father purchased the ex US army airforce leather jacket which was sold to him by the surplus store as a US flying jacket and was in very good condition with light use. The goggles were sold by the surplus store as ex RAF, late 1930's/very early wartime, flying goggles. These were new unissued when my father purchased them in 1949.

In more recent years I have questioned whether the jacket was intended for aircrew and was, in fact, a ground crew jacket but, so far, I have not found a conclusive answer.

Also the goggles appear to be of the type used by the British army for AFV crews during WW2. I'm not sure if the RAF used them as well.

As an aside during the 1950's a WW2 RAF veteran, who had been a pilot during the war, offered my father a much better flying jacket at a bargain price. Rather than quietly giving the veteran what he was asking for the jacket, my father said "That's daylight robbery!", with a big grin across his face. The veteran replied, "I don't do daylight robbery." and grabbed his jacket and walked off. The moral of this little storey is if you are offered a bargain take it, don't try and knock the person down further and don't make stupid and sarcastic remarks during the negotiations.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Sapper740]

AH! AJS, Norton, Villiers, Matchless, Vincent, Royal Enfield, Excelsior, Ariel, Brough, BSA, Triumph.....all register heavily on my pysche to this day as the motorcycles of my youth. My grandfather rode an Excelsior, my older brother a Triumph, one a friend a Villiers another an Ariel Square 4, and I a Norton. There's just something about British motorcycles.

[Flying10uk]

I got the impression they were WW1 surplus though.

I'm not entirely sure about the goggles. The RAF did use goggles that looked similar, with flat lenses, prior to WW2 into the early part of the war until they started using MK 7 goggles with angled lenses but the army appear to have used the flat lens style of goggles also.

[GeeRam]

In more recent years I have questioned whether the jacket was intended for aircrew and was, in fact, a ground crew jacket but, so far, I have not found a conclusive answer.

Also the goggles appear to be of the type used by the British army for AFV crews during WW2. I'm not sure if the RAF used them as well.

You are correct in both assumptions.

The jacket is indeed a D-1 jacket issued to mechanics, although, its been modified as the D-1 as issued had two zipped front pockets. It wasn't uncommon for jackets to be field modified, and it could be that it was modified with the large open pockets by a pilot, as these D-1 jackets were often sought by P-38 fighter pilots as they were made from 1/4 shearling rather than the thicker 1/2 shearling of the much bulkier B-3 jackets that were usually worn by bomber crews. The B-3 was too bulky for the cockpit of the P-38, which had very poor (non-existent) cockpit heating for winter ETO ops, so P-38 pilots often got hold of the D-1 mechanics jackets for winter ops, as the thinner shearling made the jacket easier to wear in a P-38 cockpit.
So, while the jacket as issued was for ground crew, the pocket mods may indicate this one was used by a pilot.

And yes, you are correct about the goggles, which are AFV goggles, not aircrew ones. I can remember there still being lots of these still un-issued in those brown boxes for sale at militaria fairs in the early 90's.... I remember buying 2 for a fiver off a dealer about 30 years ago

[Flying10uk]

AH! AJS, Norton, Villiers, Matchless, Vincent, Royal Enfield, Excelsior, Ariel, Brough, BSA, Triumph.....all register heavily on my pysche to this day as the motorcycles of my youth. My grandfather rode an Excelsior, my older brother a Triumph, one a friend a Villiers another an Ariel Square 4, and I a Norton. There's just something about British motorcycles.

A better pic of the AJS and also one of my father's first motorbike, a BSA Bantam.

[Flying10uk]

You are correct in both assumptions.

The jacket is indeed a D-1 jacket issued to mechanics, although, its been modified as the D-1 as issued had two zipped front pockets. It wasn't uncommon for jackets to be field modified, and it could be that it was modified with the large open pockets by a pilot, as these D-1 jackets were often sought by P-38 fighter pilots as they were made from 1/4 shearling rather than the thicker 1/2 shearling of the much bulkier B-3 jackets that were usually worn by bomber crews. The B-3 was too bulky for the cockpit of the P-38, which had very poor (non-existent) cockpit heating for winter ETO ops, so P-38 pilots often got hold of the D-1 mechanics jackets for winter ops, as the thinner shearling made the jacket easier to wear in a P-38 cockpit.
So, while the jacket as issued was for ground crew, the pocket mods may indicate this one was used by a pilot.

And yes, you are correct about the goggles, which are AFV goggles, not aircrew ones. I can remember there still being lots of these still un-issued in those brown boxes for sale at militaria fairs in the early 90's.... I remember buying 2 for a fiver off a dealer about 30 years ago

Thanks GeeRam, how interesting.