Lee Enfields at gun shows - is it worth getting out of bed?

[spinecracker]

First off, I would like to say that I am stunned at the expertise shown in these forums - makes us newbies quite apprehensive and terrified, but you gotta start somewhere....

A large gun show is coming up in Reno, Nevada on 14-16 August, and I will be poking my nose around it as more of a fact-finding mission than anything else, but I was wondering what my chances might be of finding a Lee Enfield No.4 Mk.1 or 1* (happy if it is FTR, not looking for FUBAR) that is original WWII configuration. I have been looking at as many posts as I can regarding these beautiful guns, and there appears to be some varying opinions regarding how scarse they are and how much one might set you back. I will be researching exactly what to look for from a historical point of view (I recommend Cornelius Ryan's book "A Bridge Too Far" regarding Operation Market Garden), but I will also be going with someone who is extremely knowledgeable regarding rifle shooting, maintenance, safety, etc (heck, I might be smart, but even a genius can end up buying a piece of %$%^).

Information

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[bearhunter]

Those rifles are probably easier to find in the US than here in Canada. For one thing, your borders are much more open than ours. That's the good news. The bad news is be very careful as to what you buy. It's OK to be fussy and hold out for what you want. The other thing is, if you find what you want within $50 of what you are willing to pay, buy it, it will cost a lot more than that to order on line and get it shipped and pay the taxes, not to mention the cost of running around looking for another one which may prove quite elusive if it's a rare specimen.

Finding what you're looking for shouldn't be difficult if you know what to look for. In the case of the No4 MkI, the left receiver flat will be a veritable diary of the rifle's service and repair. There will be other identifying features, like a screw through the fore end in front of the magazine. That is usually a sign of Indian or Pakistani service. The Turkish LEs will be anything from excellent to absolute dogs and mixmasters. One sure thing about milsurps, there is a lot of junk out there. Be especially careful with bores and carry a bore light. Be courteious with the sellers and ask questions if you're not sure. Most of them will be only to happy to help and are honest. If you insist on telling them what they have, they just might let you sell yourself on a dog.

This is just a smattering, but should be a good basic starting point. So many countries used the No4 rifles that it would be a good idea to bone up on property marks as well.

[jmoore]

Until you really know what to look for its probably best not to get too excited over any one rifle, especially at a show! You will miss some nice ones along (as far as rare variants), but No4's are best enjoyed as something to shoot!

Bore condition is important, crisp rifling at the muzzle and a good sharp throat have more influence than a lightly "frosted" appearance. Check that the barrel requires upward pressure to move in the forestock(side to side is bad).

Check Mr. Laidler's posts for the most coherent points on checking and maintaining No4's !!!!!!

Plenty more ,but break time's over!

[limpetmine]

Right now, we are in the "Happy Days" of post war Enfield collecting. This happens about every ten years or so, when a cache of guns is sold off by some country. The Enfields that are about night now are the /2, /3 conversions of the NO4Mk1 and Mk1*. Don't pass up a chance to get one of these if you see one, if may not come again for a long time. I like haunting the gun shows, as I'm able to see what I'm looking at (and for), instead of a picture or two off the internet. I've got some good finds off the auction sites, but some disappointment as well (but really, not many). Buy a good book and read up, and have a plan! Good luck.

[No4Mk1(T)]

Buy a good book and read up.

Best advice ever!
Another good source of information is of course the entries in the Milsurp Knowledge Library.
Have a look through the virtual tours of the rifles you are mainly interested in and if need be make some notes and print of a few small photos. Every little bit of information helps.

[spinecracker]

Thanks for these excellent pointers. I am slowly learning what to look for using this website and others, and will be purchasing some texts as soon as the finances warrant it. I will certainly have a plan when I hit the floor at the Reno gun show, and I will have a checklist of things to look for and to avoid (including service marks - a language all by itself). Heck, if anyone else on this forum is going to the Reno show, let's meet for Denny's...

[tlvaughn]

It's an addiction, as soon as you buy your first, you cannot wait for your next one. I do not have the years of collecting nor knowledge of most on this site, but I do have an addiction.

I have books by Petrillo, Stratton, and Skennerton and look at them on a regular basis (any other recommendations would be greatly appreciated).

So far this year I have purchased a Mk 1, Mk 1/2, Mk 1/3, and Mk 2 (3 at shows and 1 over the internet). Just this week I ordered two more No 4's and hope to see them within a week to 10 days (I feel like a kid waiting for Santa Claus).

Good Luck in Reno and enjoy your Enfield's.

[spinecracker]

Sheesh - save some for the rest of us lol