1894 Saddle ring Carbine

[yardbird]

I have had this little rifle for over 40 years and time to find out who or what about it..It is 7.65 Cal. I was thinking Turk, but have also been told Spanish..07xx serial number.some years back I knew of some carbine collctors, but have lost track of them..The reason I was thinking Turk. It has this half moon stamped on it..

Information

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[Patrick Chadwick]

It is a Spanish M1892 carbine (i.e. an improved M1891) made by Ludwig Loewe in Berlin. The 1894 is the production year, not a model number. That is a Spanish crest above "Berlin 1894"

[yardbird]

Thanks for the quick reply...Is it the model 92/93 that I have been reading about? This action will not trick..like a model 91 Argentina rifle.

[Patrick Chadwick]

Is it the model 92/93 that I have been reading about? This action will not trick..like a model 91 Argentina rifle.

Well I don't know what you have been reading! Ball shows Spanish Models 1892 rifle,1892 carbine, and 1893 rifle but no 1892/3 model. Even though some collectors may have other opinions, I like to stick with the designations according to Ball, otherwise we all end up confusing ourselves.

As to "This action will not trick..like a model 91 Argentina rifle." - I am puzzled. Could you perhaps clarify that?

[yardbird]

I guess I Google to much..found another there with the same Cresent on it . but not in very good shape and they called it a 1891 Spanish Carbine..what I call trick is when you can pull the trigger and let the bolt down on a rifle and relax the firing pin spring. Thanks..Roy

[villiers]

I do like saddle ring carbines. And I´d pay a lot for your´s just for the Ludwig Loewe maker´s mark. I missed a very nice Werder short *rsed carbine on German e-Gun recently the went for a song. There´s another on at the moment for 3.000€! I´d hang on to that gun!

[jmoore]

It is a Spanish M1892 carbine (i.e. an improved M1891) made by Ludwig Loewe in Berlin. The 1894 is the production year, not a model number. That is a Spanish crest above "Berlin 1894"

It IS 7,65 cal., yes? I thought it was Argentinian, but I've never seen one w/ the crest still on it. A friend made one of these little carbines his first rifle back in 1980 or so. Not knowing any better, he bought a box of Norma ammo for it, which is rather warm for this action. Flinch making beastie!

What, if any details besides the marking differentiate this carbine from the 1891?

Y'all are going to get me on a Mauser binge...

[yardbird]

I have 2 Engineer carbines and one Calvary, and all have the Argentine crest..I can not trick the bolt..You can with a 91...

It IS 7,65 cal., yes? I thought it was Argentinian, but I've never seen one w/ the crest still on it. A friend made one of these little carbines his first rifle back in 1980 or so. Not knowing any better, he bought a box of Norma ammo for it, which is rather warm for this action. Flinch making beastie!

What, if any details besides the marking differentiate this carbine from the 1891?

Y'all are going to get me on a Mauser binge...

[jon_norstog]

The crescent moon stamp is interesting ... sold to the Turks? Perhaps during WWI?

jn

[Patrick Chadwick]

Roy, thanks for the explanation. If I understood you correctly, by "trick" you mean closing the bolt and simultaneously decocking it so that you don't have to pull the trigger on an empty chamber to let down the firing spring.

Well, I think it ought to work. I do not have a Spanish M92, but I do have a 7x57 Boer Mauser, which has a similar mechanism. If you remove the bolt from your '92 Mauser you will see that there is a stud in the bottom of the raceway that rises up when you press the trigger. This serves as an interlock to prevent the trigger being pulled before the bolt is fully forward and cocked. The trigger can only be fully depressed if that stud can enter a a corresponding recess which you can also see on the bottom of the bolt body.

The key word in that last sentence was "fully". If you press the trigger lightly while pushing the bolt forwards you should find that, just as the bolt is started to cock, the trigger interlock stud will slip into the recess and the cocking piece will slip past the trigger sear, thus letting down the firing pin . You should feel a kind of double-click as the cocking piece starts to catch and then releases.

Be very clear - it would be EXTREMELY DANGEROUS TO DO THIS WITH A LIVE ROUND as you would be provoking something similar in its effects to a slam fire.
But it should work so that you can let down the firing spring for storage.

Patrick


P.S. If it does not work on your rifle, then maybe my Boer Mauser is just so worn that the interlock allows the "trick".