Canadian No.4 rifles used by European nations

[x westie]

After the end of the war in Europe-1945, did the Canadian Army leave most of their No.4 rifles in Europe for use by friendly European nations,..i know the Dutch Army used the No.4 rifle, as i talked to several Dutch veterans who served in the Dutch East Indies-1947-1948 time frame, and they talked to me about the Canadian Lee Enfield Rifles,

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[Roger Payne]

I only know anecdotally, but friendly Euro nations were most definitely re-equipped with British Commonwealth weapons in the immediate post-war period. Countries like Belgium, Holland, France & Italy used Enfields extensively. About ten years ago the late Pete Bloom managed to scoop thirty CNo32 TP scopes complete with their mounts that were ex-Dutch army issue. They were all in superb order & I was lucky enough to prize a few out of him, though they've all long since gone, sadly!

[Peter Laidler]

These nations used to attend the sniper courses at Hythe with TP/Lyman sighted rifles which wouldn't fit into the syllabus for many reasons so they'd arrive on the course with a Lyman, do the course with a No4T/No32 and according to the late Doug Maber, take it back home. Once the real McCoy started to come on stream, the Lymans stayed in the Ordnance depots

[Mk VII]

Canada gave a large quantity of military equipment (several division's worth) to Belgium and Holland after the war. From 1950 US military aid (though not smallarms) was available to Canada on a dollar-for-dollar basis when it disposed of its British-type equipment in this way.

[x westie]

i believe, but correct me if im wrong,..but all the Canadian Sherman Tanks that the armored regiments used, stayed Europe, and the Canadian Military Pattern Trucks,..also in 1946-47, the Canadian Government bought new Sherman Tanks equiped with the 76mm gun from the US

[Peter Laidler]

A chap that lives around here has a Sherman Firefly with a 17 pounder gun, purchased from Portugal in the 80's that was Canadian he believes from the original markings under layers of subsequent paint

[tiriaq]

There was a batch of LB rifles imported back into Canada from Belgium which included a quantity of new-in-the-grease 1950 dated rifles. Obviously these didn't come from Commonwealth stores stockpiled from the War.

[Brian Dick]

Don't forget the Long Branch rifles imported back via England from Greece in the late 1990's early 2000's. There were wartime as well as 1950 dates.

[bow]

Here in Italy we had Long Branch No4mki* built during war and in 1950..In addition we had No1mkIII and some No4mkI British manufactured. They were used from italian Navy. Italian infantry between 1950 - 1970 had british "turtle" helmet. No. 32 scopes were used till 1990 , mounted upon SC70 5.56 assoult rifle....Some photos depict italian soldiers in Sarajevo , 1993, with No32 scope ( I believe range turrets we're uncorrect..).

[Frederick303]

Two data points: I have to add is the source of the Danish M53 rifle (M1917 rifles) was Canada. The Canadians bought ~100,000 from the US of A in June~July 1940 to replace all of the No1 and Ross rifles they sent over to the UK (about 75,000 of each). The Danish arm records show they got their rifles from Canada, presumably in 1953. Denmark also bought a batch of these rifles from Norway in 1958, if my memory serves me correctly. I do not know the source of those rifles, they could have come from the UK, the US or Canada. If someone is really interested I can go pull up the data from research notes, I have it is some file someplace.

The other data point I have is a discussion with a fellow whose father had joined the Bundeswehr in 1955, just at the time it was set up. According to this fellow, their first training rifles were Canadian No 4 rifles. His father was surprised by this, as the Grenzeschuzte, which were effectively light infantry, had Kar98K rifles and MG42 MGs, along with Italian MP38/42’s, they pretty much looked like WWII German infantry. I do not recall all the exact details, but I seem to recall that he said their initial training equipment was all Canadian, including the uniforms, but with US pattern steel pots. I seem to recall him saying, but am not sure if this is correct, that the NCOs were also Canadian, or at least the German ones were supervised by Canadians.

His comments were this had to be because none of the old time NCO’s from WWII would rejoin. The Officers might rejoin, but the men who had had to fight and die had had enough, so the new German army had to pretty much start from scratch on building an NCO corps.

The rifles were changed out pretty quickly, with what I do not recall; I think it was M1 rifles and M1 carbines in 1956, about the time they got their own real equipment.