Continued Education

[shottist]

Can some one please enlighten me about the packaging of .303 British ammunition? All that I have seen are boxed in 32 round boxes which seems a strange number for a Rifle that has a Magazine capacity of 10 rounds. Is this the result of British eccentricy or is there something I'm missing here? Thank you.

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[Edward Horton]

Because a 320 round tin of ammunition has room for 10 boxes of ammunition with 32 rounds in each box
(the British soldier was only allowed to drop one cartridge for every fifteen cartridges he loaded)



The American 30-06 ammunition for the M1 came in 20 round boxes which had four cartridges left over.
(American soldier was allowed to drop twice as many cartridges as the British did)



In other words I have no idea why…………………

[shottist]

Thank you. I feel much better now.

[Thunderbox]

The cardboard ammunition boxes were never intended to equate to the magazine capacity of any particular small arm. After all, there were many possible .303 weapons and magazine capacities - rifle, Lewis gun (normal and big mags), Hotchkiss, Vickers, etc.

The cardboard boxes are merely of a convenient size and dimension to be able to fit into standard wooden/tin small arms ammo crates: either 39 (sometimes just 38) of the 32-round boxes with individual dividers, or 26 of the 48-round boxes where the rounds lie in rows - total 1248 rounds in the crate. The size and dimensions of these standard crates are themselves a holdover from Martini-Henry days, and represent a size & weight that is just about manageable by a single man.

[ireload2]

It appears that there are people on the web more ate up with ammunition packaging than with Lee-Enfields. Sorry I even looked.

At one site I found a box for 8mm Besa. So whay did the Brits use the 8X57 in tanks?

British Ammo packaging

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[Peter Laidler]

We used 7.92mm in our old BESA tank machine guns. But as soon as the British tasted the 'new' .300" Browning in the warime tanks, the old BESA was sidelined. The first post war tanks used the BESA but thereafter, the Mk3 Centurion reverted to the old favourite and unstoppable Browning M1919's. The old BESA continued on in service on Churchill recovery, bridgelayer and other 'funnies' until 1966 when the last BESA's were scrapped

[Mk VII]

In view of the limited role of the BESA it was reluctantly accepted in the 7.92mm calibre, as it was not possible to alter the design to shoot .303

[ireload2]

I always found it interesting that with the Bren gun and it's parent Czech design everyone seemed to be shooting at each other with the same basic design.
The Japanese shot at Brits and Aussies with 7.7X56Rs and the Brits in tanks shot at the Germans with 8X57s.
Of course the Finns stacked up the Ruskies with their own rifles.

In watching post Normandy documentary footage I have seen a German soldier with a #4Mk1T and in the Italian campaign apparently a USGI or an someone dressed in US battle dress was mopping up Italian ruins with a #4Mk1.

[harry mac]

In watching post Normandy documentary footage I have seen a German soldier with a #4Mk1T and in the Italian campaign apparently a USGI or an someone dressed in US battle dress was mopping up Italian ruins with a #4Mk1.

I have seen old newsreel footage which apparently shows the first link up of British and American troops in one part of NW Europe and it quite clearly shows the American soldier armed with a No4. I suppose the reporters of the day wouldn't have been above getting some Tommy to dress up in an American uniform and have the clip posed.

[Thunderbox]

I have seen old newsreel footage which apparently shows the first link up of British and American troops in one part of NW Europe and it quite clearly shows the American soldier armed with a No4. I suppose the reporters of the day wouldn't have been above getting some Tommy to dress up in an American uniform and have the clip posed.

It would also have made sense for bridgehead flanks to contain liaison parties from the other national contingents, but to temporarily arm them with the weapons supported in that bridgehead in case the link-up is delayed or fails. I.e. there were probably British liaison troops on Omaha armed with M1s, etc.