No.1 Mk III HT scope mounts

[tower06]

Does anyone know of any source for replica Mk III HT scope mounts? If not, is there a source for drawings with dimensions for the mounts? I have a Ishapore that I want to set up with a scope, but none of the available modern mounts seem to look right. I figure get a set of low mounts if I can, or if not replicas are out there, my dads friend owns a machine shap and would be willing to make a set for me. I just need the specs. Any help or direction would be appreciated.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Badger]

Hi ..

Although it doesn't contain actual blueprints or drawings, with thanks to Advisory Panel members Lance, Son, John Thorne, Wheaty and Jollygreenslugg for their assistance, there's an entry in the Australia - Milsurp Knowledge Library (click here), complete with a 222 picture photo montage. The photo montage has LOTS of close ups of the scope mounts taken from different angles

Australian No.1 MkIII* H.T. Sniper Rifle (click here)

c/w matching serial number A.O.C. Model 1918 (3x) Scope
(Mfg by Australian Optical Co., Victoria)

c/w Canvas web sling with an inside layer of hard plastic (latex?).
(Mfg in 1941 by B.H.G. Ltd)

This is one of only 481 rifles (short bracket) converted by Lithgow and this particular rifle is documented as having been sent to stores on Sept 19th, 1945.

There are several follow up sections with additional pics noted in the "Collector's Feedback and Comments" section of the main library entry, covering the progressive numbering of mounts and what to look for, pics showing font and stamping examples with extreme close-ups (helpful in spotting incorrect or reproduction components), a discussion of the WWII ersatz canvas sling, a discussion and pictorial comparison of "low" and "high" mount versions of these rifles including A.O.C. scope markings, plus some excellent videos of another H.T. sniper rifle currently in a private collection and also a tour of the Lithgow facility showing video of their internal H.T. collection.

Hope this helps get you started...

Regards,
Badger

[tower06]

Hi ..

Although it doesn't contain actual blueprints or drawings, with thanks to Advisory Panel members Lance, Son, John Thorne, Wheaty and Jollygreenslugg for their assistance, there's an entry in the Australia - Milsurp Knowledge Library (click here), complete with a 222 picture photo montage. The photo montage has LOTS of close ups of the scope mounts taken from different angles

Australian No.1 MkIII* H.T. Sniper Rifle (click here)

c/w matching serial number A.O.C. Model 1918 (3x) Scope
(Mfg by Australian Optical Co., Victoria)

c/w Canvas web sling with an inside layer of hard plastic (latex?).
(Mfg in 1941 by B.H.G. Ltd)

This is one of only 481 rifles (short bracket) converted by Lithgow and this particular rifle is documented as having been sent to stores on Sept 19th, 1945.

There are several follow up sections with additional pics noted in the "Collector's Feedback and Comments" section of the main library entry, covering the progressive numbering of mounts and what to look for, pics showing font and stamping examples with extreme close-ups (helpful in spotting incorrect or reproduction components), a discussion of the WWII ersatz canvas sling, a discussion and pictorial comparison of "low" and "high" mount versions of these rifles including A.O.C. scope markings, plus some excellent videos of another H.T. sniper rifle currently in a private collection and also a tour of the Lithgow facility showing video of their internal H.T. collection.

Hope this helps get you started...

Regards,
Badger

I did see this...thank you. If I can't find any specs. I figure I can use this to make approximate drawing on my own. If anyone has some original mounts and had the time to take some measurements for me, that would be great also. The pics on the thread are good enough that I think I can make a close enough drawing myself however. I figure an Ishy with a close replica scope mount will look rather nice on the firing line at my range.

Thanks again, and happy holidays.

[Bruce_in_Oz]

There are a few problems to consider:

1. The Patt 18 scopes are hard to find now in good condition and fitted with the correct rings.

2. If you find one without Aust. pattern rings, the scope has to be dismantled to fit the rings, if you can find them.

3. The process of fitting the scope involved a collimation process in which the bases were aligned in a special jig and the scope is aligned to a Mean Point of Impact on a target using the settings on the iron sights. You cannot just whack a set of bases on the rifle and go for it, if you intend to shoot the rifle seriously.

4. If you could get the bases, you MIGHT be able to use a modern optical collimator to help adjust them on to the rifle to suit your scope.

5. Bedding in an Aust sniper is a bit different because of the heavy barrel.

I suspect one of the reasons for the tiny production of the originals was the arcane set-up procedures necessitated by the Patt 18 scope and the engineering decision to copy pre-WW1 German sporting scope mounts.

[tower06]

There are a few problems to consider:

1. The Patt 18 scopes are hard to find now in good condition and fitted with the correct rings.

2. If you find one without Aust. pattern rings, the scope has to be dismantled to fit the rings, if you can find them.

3. The process of fitting the scope involved a collimation process in which the bases were aligned in a special jig and the scope is aligned to a Mean Point of Impact on a target using the settings on the iron sights. You cannot just whack a set of bases on the rifle and go for it, if you intend to shoot the rifle seriously.

4. If you could get the bases, you MIGHT be able to use a modern optical collimator to help adjust them on to the rifle to suit your scope.

5. Bedding in an Aust sniper is a bit different because of the heavy barrel.

I suspect one of the reasons for the tiny production of the originals was the arcane set-up procedures necessitated by the Patt 18 scope and the engineering decision to copy pre-WW1 German sporting scope mounts.

Was actually thinking of using a vintage Redfield scope or something with similar tube diameter.

[Son]

tower06, I'm afraid the complexities of the rings and bases alone make them a machining nightmare, but add to that the need to machine a flat and a tiny half dovetail on the side of the charger bridge to exactly the right depth in both directions and you've just found out why nobody has ever bothered to accurately reproduce these set-ups.

Honestly, if you feel you must put a scope on your SMLE, then try to track down one of the old Parker Hale one piece mounts or similar that was screwed onto the top of the charger bridge and the receiver ring. I think they are still being made.
Pics below, the rear base from a HT, a HT receiver showing where it came off, and a sporter scope mount. If you are going to drill and tap it anyway, may as well put a decent mount on for bugger-all cost. The direction you are thinking of will only cause you expense and heartache, for no real value in the result.

Sorry to disappoint......
Son

[tower06]

tower06, I'm afraid the complexities of the rings and bases alone make them a machining nightmare, but add to that the need to machine a flat and a tiny half dovetail on the side of the charger bridge to exactly the right depth in both directions and you've just found out why nobody has ever bothered to accurately reproduce these set-ups.

Honestly, if you feel you must put a scope on your SMLE, then try to track down one of the old Parker Hale one piece mounts or similar that was screwed onto the top of the charger bridge and the receiver ring. I think they are still being made.
Pics below, the rear base from a HT, a HT receiver showing where it came off, and a sporter scope mount. If you are going to drill and tap it anyway, may as well put a decent mount on for bugger-all cost. The direction you are thinking of will only cause you expense and heartache, for no real value in the result.

Sorry to disappoint......
Son

Been looking for the Parker Hale one piece mounts. Anyone have a source I could look at?

[Brian Dick]

I've got a couple P-H SMLE bases here. I also have some low rings available. Email directly to bdlltd@bellsouth.net if interested. Brian

[tower06]

Thought I would ressurect this because I actually found replica mounts on ebay.
Repro Scope Mount British Enfield 303 1918 P 14 sniper - eBay (item 160518200679 end time Dec-18-10 12:22:00 PST)

Anyone ever see these before and know who makes them?

[jmoore]

Thought I would ressurect this because I actually found replica mounts on ebay.

Repro Scope Mount British Enfield 303 1918 P 14 sniper - eBay (item 160518200679 end time Dec-18-10 12:22:00 PST)

 

Anyone ever see these before and know who makes them?

 

Those are for the P'14 rifle, the "other" WWI Enfield. Don't know the mfg., sorry!