Hand-Me-Down NRA Sporter?

[mariodawg]

Hello All. I am currently deployed with the USAF, but before I left, I loaded my laptop up with pics of a SA Model 1903 I inherited recently. I have no intention of selling the gun, so I don't care really about its value. However, it does appear to be quite a nice Model 1903, and it appears to be a nra sporter. However, based on research i have already done, the fact that it lacks a barrel band, and being that the front sight is not standard, I am not 100% sure if its an original NRA sporter. It has a star gauged barrel, and the serial number on the top of the receiver matches the bolt's stenciled serial number. The front of the barrel shows it was produced in 1 -32. Serial number is 1406882. The stock also lacks a circle P on it. However, a knowledgable guy at a gun show informed me that based on what he saw, the gun appeared to be either 100% original, or at least "period correct", based on the grade/stain of the wood, its lack of signs/markings indicating it was modified, etc. So I am attaching some pics and hoping for some informative feedback. Thanks!

Information

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[Rick the Librarian]

I got your question on the M1903.com forum and am researching your rifle. From your pictures, it appears to be a modified NRA Sporter, as you guessed. Is there a number, like "B4776" about one third of the way from the receiver end on the top of the barrel?

The rifle is NOT "100% original". It was bought and modified significently. Springfield did not make those sort of modifications, but a large number of gunsmiths of the period could have done so.

RtL

[mariodawg]

RtL, I just Skyped my wife, and asked her to look. She says there are no numbers or letters of any sort on top of the barrel. So it is an NRA Sporter, though? That's excellent, even if its not 100% original. Would it be considered "proper" to try to have this gun redone back to its original look, or should I leave it as is? Or, since it's already significantly modified, would it still be considered a a no-no in gun-collector circles to not have the gun modified any more than it already is, say like if i decided to have a gunsmith make the gun better than it already is? I have no such plans in either direction, but I'm just curious. Also, do you think the stock is also non-original? i noticed the sling hardware is quite non-standard also.

[Calif-Steve]

Best of luck on the deployment. Been there done that, myself. I think you have a very nice keeper. Not so sure I would do anything with it. Very common in the '30's to buy a new barrel and receiver directly from Springfield. You could buy parts or assembled, either way. NM or Service. Then a local or well-known gunsmith would finish the rifle for you. It appears to be a GI stock that was well done, most likely a NRA Sporter stock. I would hang on to it. There is a kind gentleman at CMP-South called "Lyn". When you get home try to track him down, have him eyeball it. He is a friend of John Beard. Good luck on the tour of duty, my friend.

[Johnny Peppers]

Your rifle is a DCM Sales NRA Sporter that has been modified from it's original configuration into a more commercial type rifle. The original stock was retained, and it appears the original buttplate was modified and retained.
The stargage number on a Sporter barrel is on the bottom where it is hid.

[Cosine26]

There are two things about the rear sight on this rifle that I noticed. The sight has the turn down peep and the rear mounted windage scale associated with the Lyman 48S sight not the Lyman 48C. I thought that the "Sporter" always came with the Lyman 48C. On looking at the top view and comparing this picture with my NM903 and its Lyman 48C and other 48C equipped 03's,it looks as if the sight is mounted too far foward. It looks to me as if the gallows arm would interfer with clip loading. I do not have a "Sporter" for comparison so cannot be sure. Since the SN indicates that this falls within the last year of "Sporter" manufacture, perhaps the 48S was substituted for the 48C. An SRS lettter would confirm that this was/is a true "Sporter".
Comments?

[Rick the Librarian]

The stargage number on a Sporter barrel is on the bottom where it is hid.

Oops! Forgot about that - thanks for the correction, Johnny!

[mariodawg]

Thanks to the replies, observations and comments to Cosine26, Johnny Peppers, Calif-Steve, and of course, Rick the Librarian! First I want to say I am thrilled that it looks like this is in fact an authentic NRA Sporter, just one that isn't 100% original from the factory. In fact, there happens to be what is described as an all-original NRA Sporter at this link, http://www.auctionarms.com/closed/di...mnum=8202108.0, and the serial number on that rifle is only 50 or so units off of my serial number (and i think star-gauged barrels were made is batches). So based on previous research I conducted via the Internet, and referenceing two books I have on the M1903, it is cool that my initial observations appear to have been correct (authentic NRA Sporter in non-original condition). I will be more thrilled, however, once i know the wood stock is indeed original. I mean, the front sight's originality is not a big deal to me---and i could easily replace it with an original front sight, and not really "mutilate" or "devalue" the weapon (the one thing I don't like about the front sight? it covers the SA numbers/symbols on top of the barrel!). But the fact that the gun doesn't have a barrel band does strike me as strange---because wouldn't removing the band leave an indelible mark, or screw hole, or some sign on the barrel or stock that would suggest that at one time there was something there that is now missing? And this relates to the stock---I am really hoping the stock is original (obviously i don't care if it was properly resized to fit the buyer), because let's face it: outside of the barrel/bolt/receiver, the stock is a very important part of the weapon---at least to me as far as originality goes. But if its the original stock, then wouldn't i be able to maybe one day find a proper NRA Sporter barrel band, and install it again without "mutilating/devalue" the weapon? I mean, if it can be removed and not mark the weapon, then couldn't one easily be re-installed? So here are a few questions if I may ask, as i really am interested in this family/firearm piece of history:

For Johnny Peppers: 1) So you do feel its an original stock? But then how was the buttplate "modified & retained"? 2) Isn't there more checkering on this rifle stock than what came on production NRA Sporter stocks?

For Cosine26: 1) Look at the link I gave above, and you'll see lots of pics of what is advertised (and looks correct to me) as a 100% original NRA Sporter. Compare the pics of that Lyman Sight and how its mounted with mine, because that gun is only about 50 units off from mine serial number-wise. Then tell me what you think? 2) What is an SRS Letter, and how do I pay for someone to do a archive assessment of my rifle (I assume an SRS is some sort of authentication service?).

For Caif-Steve: Thanks for the links and contact info. I will look those guys up before i leave. As for my stock: 1) Is my stock supposed to have a "circled 'P'" on it? My stock has no marks stamped on it. I will try to attach more photos to help you guys help me. I really appreciate this you guys, and this helps keep me busy when I'm bored!

[mariodawg]

So based on the Johnny Peppers/Rick the Librarian "chat", am I to assume that maybe that number we were looking for on top of the barrel 1/3 of the way down the barrel from the receiver end was actually supposed to be the Star gauge info that is on the bottom side of the barrel, hidden from view? I am aware that there is supposed to be info stamped on my barrel on the bottom side, but i have not had the barrel removed from the stock----yet.

[Johnny Peppers]

This is the sight on an original Sporter sold in 1923. Being primarily a sporting rifle, clip loading would not be an issue I suppose.



---------- Post added at 11:18 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:12 PM ----------

For Johnny Peppers: 1) So you do feel its an original stock? But then how was the buttplate "modified & retained"? 2) Isn't there more checkering on this rifle stock than what came on production NRA Sporter stocks?

Yes, I believe that is the original stock which has been modified.
Here is a shot of an unaltered Sporter buttplate.