Canadian Ranger Rifles, 2007

[tiriaq]

AMEN! I'm certain that some of the CNo.4 Mk1* rifles were new in the grease when they were issued up here, now they look like something from that Afghan weapons cache!

Possibly worse. Sea coast, salt water.

[Stevo]

Can you imagine what would have happened to the C1 rifles, had they been given to the Rangers?

You seem to have an axe to grind against the entire Ranger program due to your experience with one Patrol. Do not continue to disparage all of us for the actions of some.

If you chose to keep insulting dedicated Rangers like Riflechair and myself, take it somewhere else.

I don't dispute that some Rangers are lousy at looking after their kit as tiriaq says. However, that does not hold true for all.

[tiriaq]

At one time, there were 3 LB No. 4T rifles with 32TP (Lyman Alaskan) scopes held at NRHQ in YK. They were supposed to be issued into the Eastern Arctic. The WO responsible knew how rare these rifles were, and would not issue them East, because he knew what would happen to them. AFAIK, they were diverted to the Yukon.

[K31]

Yes, I have noticed, in photos of the Northern patrols, that some of them still carry old SMLE's, that appear to be in great shape. I didn't intend to disrespect the Rangers, and am very sorry if I did. The local patrol got off to a really bad start here, the first patrol leader was a real winner, and the second one, almost as bad. But the new leader has really turned the patrol around, and the bad apples are gone now. I am considering joining the patrol, myself. But I, and even many of the Rangers, believe that issuing the C1 would have been a mistake. They would have to put much more emphasis on rifle training, and, in any case, the C1 would gobble up the ammo at an alarming rate! Imagine having a semi-auto with free ammo? I guess it would encourage more practice. Personally, I think the government had the right idea when they issued the .30WCF M94 carbines during the war. They were light, easy to shoot, already familiar to most outdoorsmen, and reasonably powerful. They also stand up remarkably well in the woods. I sometimes see the odd one even today. They are still in use by hunters, and some I would swear have never been cleaned! I have yet to see one with the original sling fittings, though. When the weapons were issued to Rangers during the war, the guys with the M17 always tried to trade with the guys with 30-30's. One guy got a ROSS, and he was most displeased! The bolt "fell" overboard while he was cleaning it! He got a WINCHESTER M17 as a replacement. During the war, some of the Rangers even got STEN guns. I have photos of them ventilating sea lions with them! IMAGINE! The government trusting the people with automatic weapons! How things have changed! One fellow told me that the PCMR's trained on the L.E. , 30-30, M17, STEN, and BREN.

[Stevo]

There are no SMLE's in service with the Rangers.

[K31]

I saw an article somewhere, I think LEGION magazine, but I can't remember, which showed an INUIT fellow with his rifle, an SMLE. Also, there was a NATURE of THINGS episode which showed an INUIT lady who had shot a polar bear with an SMLE. I seem to recall seeing them in a READER's DIGEST article a few years back, too. Of course, this was a decade ago, things have probably changed.

[tiriaq]

The photos must have been taken many years ago. There were no SMLEs issued in the past 30 years. Were likely privately owned surplus rifles.
The WW2 PCMR and the Canadian Rangers are not the same organization, although the modern Ranger program had its roots in the WW2 experience. The PCMR were the first Cdn. formation to be issued Stens during WW2.

[Claven2]

Personally, I think the government had the right idea when they issued the .30WCF M94 carbines during the war. They were light, easy to shoot, already familiar to most outdoorsmen, and reasonably powerful. They also stand up remarkably well in the woods.

That would be a most horrendous mistake. I am glad you are not in charge to implement this change!

The Winchester 94 is a great gun in the WOODS. It is a POS above the Canadian Shield on the tundra. The Extraction is not positive enough under very cold conditions (think minus 30 celsius BEFORE wind chill). No inuit use it for hunting that I know of. It rapidly becomes unreliable in very cold weather.

I like the 94 and even sometimes carry mine, but it is NOT an arctic solution. In the artic it is a problem. Rounds tend to stick in the chambers and the extractor slips off the cartridge rim, causing a hopeless jam. That is the LAST thing you would want confronting a polar bear.

[Claven2]

I saw an article somewhere, I think LEGION magazine, but I can't remember, which showed an INUIT fellow with his rifle, an SMLE. Also, there was a NATURE of THINGS episode which showed an INUIT lady who had shot a polar bear with an SMLE. I seem to recall seeing them in a READER's DIGEST article a few years back, too. Of course, this was a decade ago, things have probably changed.

Not all Inuit are in the Rangers.

[K31]

Yes, the 94 could be problematic in the Arctic. I was just thinking about the West Coast guys. The old 94's had a depression on top of the bolt, so you could press the extractor down with your thumb if it wasn't gripping. In any case, I wouldn't want to face a polar bear with a 30-30! I heard somewhere that the PCMR also had the 336 MARLIN, is this true? I have never seen one so marked. How many STENS were issued to them? What happened to the SMLE's? Were the Rangers given the option to buy them? I read that some second generation INUIT Rangers were using their Father's rifles.