Issue / Use of L4A1 Magazines

[peregrinvs]

Hi,

Having today acquired my second example of an L4A1 magazine, (RSAF Enfield, 1959) I was wondering how these were issued in use? E.g. In an infantry section, who carried the magazines for the LMG and how many?

Thanks,
Mark

Information

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[tankhunter]

Normally in Practice. It was mainly the gun Section Pair who's Mag Pouches had two mags per pouch (three per pouch if you could squeeze them in!) The rest of a mag box that contained a dozen. was distributed in the rest of the rifle section. Norm pratcice was one to two mags per riflemen each. You also have to remember, each rifleman needed his own ammo for his Own rifle, or SMG. To that end, SLR Mags or bandoliers were utilsed by the Section riflemen. It made it more difficult when the SLR was in Service. Because the riflemen needed the slr mags themselves & they took up a lot of room in the ammo pouches. So basically, anywhere a 30 round mag could be carried was the norm. Inside a smock, in a small pack, in the poncho roll on the rear of the webbing. In an emergency, SLR mags COULD be used instead of the 30 rounders. It has to be remembered. lots of full mags along with all the other equipment carried on a patrol is very heavy & fatiguing. In the days of the .303" round, it was easier, as the riflemen could carry loose clips of five rounds in one pouch, & a bandolier or two over each shoulder & accross the chest. There were canvas six mag carrier bags for the Brens also. But even six full mags one handload, WAS tireing to carry over long distances!
If you were vehicle borne, then a full metal mag box of 12 mags wasnt an issue! The vehicle carried the load & it would have been very rare to use up all 12 mags when firing from a vehicle!
Also remember, what the manual/ book says, is VERY different from how it was done for real in the field! = Peter, can you add anything to this?...........

[Brit plumber]

1959 was the first year of production so a nice find there.

[peregrinvs]

Thanks. Interesting. I shall have to dig out my other one and check the date on it. Yesterday's one was £25 at the Chelmsford militaria fair. At some point it has acquired a coat of satin black paint - is this likely to be an official addition?

Going OT: Amongst other odds and ends I also acquired a good example of an olive green Pattern 1960 combat smock in a wearable size. (Just...) Did any forumites reading this wear one of these for real?

[Peter Laidler]

Yep, I was issued with the green original combat smocks. We had them until I went to Australia in 1967 but when I came back in 1970 they'd changed to camouflage but there were still a few of the original ones in use. They were made of a material called 'sateen' at the 'ladybird' factory in Belfast. But I think it burned down - or someone burned it down! It was about the same time that we got 'woolie pullies' issued. Which was odd really because we'd had them in NZ for years! We also still had battledress trousers up until the early/mid 70's I still had a brand new pair of those sateen combat trousers until a year ago and put them on 'that' site.

What LMG magazine were you referring to. The L4A1 GUN magazine that has a small knib at the front that fits into the L4A1 and the FN or the L4A2 GUN magazine with a big block at the front, that's interchangeable with the L1A1 rifle mag.

[Kev G]

I think Mark is referering to the commonwealth locking lug magazine marked - Magazine 7.62mm L4A1 9600089.

Scale of issue of magazine from a 1961 CES -


A guide from 1968 Infantry Training Vol 1,pam 6 -


KG

[peregrinvs]

Great stuff as ever Kevin.

I don't suppose you'd have a picture handy of an L4A1 magazine box? I don't think I've ever seen one.

---------- Post added at 09:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:53 PM ----------

Yep, I was issued with the green original combat smocks. We had them until I went to Australia in 1967 but when I came back in 1970 they'd changed to camouflage but there were still a few of the original ones in use. They were made of a material called 'sateen' at the 'ladybird' factory in Belfast. But I think it burned down - or someone burned it down!

My one was made by James Smith & Co of Derby. I looked them up and apparently they were a big uniform manufacturer back in the day. Now sadly long gone to British manufacturing sector heaven.

---------- Post added at 09:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:00 PM ----------

Normally in Practice. It was mainly the gun Section Pair who's Mag Pouches had two mags per pouch (three per pouch if you could squeeze them in!)

Oh dear. I have two magazines, so it looks like I need a Pattern 1958 mag pouch to put them in. Damn this collecting kleptomania!

[Brian Dick]

I just bought a very nice L4 magazine box. I was tickled to finally get one to go with the L4A3. I'll shoot some photos of it to post if Kevin doesn't beat me too it.

[Kev G]

UK early conversion of 303 mag box for 7.62 magazines by the addition of timber packing blocks.




UK purpose made 7.62 magazine box with metal channel packing blocks with neoprene strips.




Indian purpose made 7.62 mag box to their own pattern.



Hope this helps,KG

[c310pilot]

Here is one I picked up. Any idea about the art work?