problem with certain garand enbloc clips

[dexterblack]

I'm not sure if this is the thread catagory to use, but:... My (very) left-handed brother graciously gave me his M-1 Garand (.30-06) last year, when I started shooting again after decades away from the sport. A friend of his gave me a few enbloc clips for the rifle, which work flawlessly. I purched eleven additional clips from a major shooting-supply warehouse. When I tried them out, they were "powdery", almost like they were spray painted, rather than parkerized. Only 3 worked well, while the rest were too tight: they damaged brass when loading, tended to jamb when charging the gun, and could cause the last two rounds to bind when auto-chambering.

Now, I see that another company is having a sale on enbloc clips. They list the specific manufacturer as Aggressive Engineering Corp, and the price looks reasonable. I seek someone who might be familiar with relative quality/suitabiliy of this manufacturer. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
__________________
Dexter

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[Sarge1998]

I also had problems when I first started collecting and shooting Garands, the only en blocs you should use would in my opinion be USGI. Even the ammunition bought through CMP has occasional en bloc problems, these are usually European manufacture that the Greeks contracted for.

To give a better answer I think it would help if you described what initials are present in the circular stamping of the rear outside of the en bloc. Here is a link that may help you identify the manufacturer.
Enbloc Stampings

As for the rough texture of the en bloc, use a scotch brite pad or steel wool to polish it smooth, I always check my en blocs and load each one to ensure a smooth performance at the range, even the ones packed in a bandolier get unloaded, inspected, touched up, then replaced for use.

I foolishly bought a box of 20 en blocs from CTD several years ago, the only redeeming value I received was the practice involving about every malfunction an en bloc could cause. Take my advice and use GI en blocs, and polish them up a bit and you shouldn't have a problem.

[limpetmine]

There was a thread on this not too long ago. Some of the Greek clips have heavy, almost pebbly parkerizing. Hit them with a crocus cloth and knock it down. That'll help.

[Orlando]

You know that enbloc that CMP gives with every Garand they sell, guess who makes them?
Aggressive Engineering Corp

[dexterblack]

Thanks for the info Orlando. Actually, I never bought anything from CMP. However, the other clips I purchased were sold as "U.S. made", but show no maker's mark on the bottom. And I really don't think they're Springfield, as some unmarked clips are supposed to be. I think I'll go ahead and try a small order of the "Aggressive", and see how they work. I'll keep fingers crossed and report back how they work.

Regards,

Dexter

[budmant]

I have a bunch of the Aggressive Engineering clips & have had no problems with them.

[BigFish]

I have a bunch of the Aggressive Engineering clips & have had no problems with them.

Me too. never a problem with them so far.

[PaulN]

(This is my first post on this forum so hope that I don't mess up.)

Hello Dexter;

I may have some useful information for you within a week-or-two.

(background)

Although I purchased my Garand back in late spring (2011) it was only during the Thanksgiving holidays (just a week ago now) that I was down on a cousin's ranch in central Texas and was able to shoot it. (I live in the Dallas area and there is no suitable location nearby to fire it as far as I can tell.)

The situation I ran into (which will be of interest to you) is that I had some difficulty loading the Enbloc clips into my Garand depending on what ammunition I was using.

Enbloc Clips - mfg'd by Agressive Engineering (marked on the bottom ' AEC ' with a ' 3 ' underneath)

Ammo
-------------------------
' American Eagle - For M1 Garand' (mfg by Federal Cartridge) 150 grain FMJ

' PPU Ammunition ' (mfg in Serbia - U.S. importer is TR&Z USA Trading Company) 150 grain FMJ
----------------------------

Both ammunition types are spec'd to be suitable for use in the Garand with the American Eagle explicitly stating this on the package and for the PPU ammunition I had an e-mail exchange back in May (2011) with TR&Z USA Trading Company (the PPU importer) in which they confirmed that their 150 gain FMJ .30-06 ammunition is "M2 ball specifically producted for M1 rifles".

The ' problem ' (pretty-much solved with an on-site 'fix') was that when I was loading the PPU ammunition (the American Eagle ammo loaded without any problem) into the Enbloc clip the 8th (and final) round was EXTREMELY difficult to slide into the clip and once done the clip essentially jammed (it was spread open too wide) when I tried to insert it into my Garand.

My 'on-site fix' was to load only 7 rounds of the PPU cartridges into the Enbloc clip and this resulted in the clip's 'lips' (how far they spread open when ammo is loaded) being not so far apart as with 8 rounds. The Enbloc clip's metal 'lips' still exterted sufficient pressure on the cartridges to hold them in place (taking care not to jostle them) and then the clip slid easily down into my Garland.

Today (back home) I've made a few measurements with my little manual micrometer and determined that the width of the PPU cases is very slightly greater than the American Eagle cases. This additional width (of the PPU cases) causes the Enbloc clips to spread open a little wider than when loading American Eagle ammunition. Although each PPU case is only slightly wider than the American Eagle ammo when you get 8 cartridges stagger-loaded into the Enbloc clip the additional widths add-up and cause the clip to have spread open wider by an appreciable amount.

I then phoned TR&Z USA Trading Company (the PPU importer) today and they assured me that my measurement (of their ammunition's case width) was within .30-06 specifications and they pointed-the-finger at the Enbloc clip manufacturer (TR&Z did not recognize the ' AEC ' clip manufacturer ID and I later found who they were via a Web search).

Then I phoned Aggressive Engineering (finding them via a Web search) and was assured that they build the Enbloc clips for the commercial market (I got mine through ' Cheaper-Than-Dirt ') to the same specs as when they were making them for the military market.

At that point (with the ammo manufacturer saying the problem wasn't their fault and the Enbloc clip manufacturer saying that it wasn't their fault) I pulled out my copy of the M1 Garand drawings put together by Eric Nicolaus but after about a half hour had not found a relevant drawing that showed the Enbloc clip dimensions so I went to Eric's Web Site, got his phone number, and called him.

Eric thought at first that his compendium of M1 Garland drawings had the Enbloc clip drawings but then (thinking out loud) said that he realized that he had left it out. Eric then (very gratiously) volunteered to mail me a copy of the Enbloc clip drawing only asking that I keep him informed what I learn. The drawing will probably arrive in the mail next week.

So that's my story on Enbloc clip width when using PPU ammunition - with more-to-follow (probably) next week once I've gotten a look at the specs for the clip.

- Paul

[Orlando]

Nothing wrong with Agressive Engineering enblocs, unless you got a bad one.

[PaulN]

Nothing wrong with Agressive Engineering enblocs, unless you got a bad one.

I've seen no evidence of a variation between the 'AEC' Encloc clips that I have. (The ' American Eagle ' ammunition all loads into the clips just fine and the ' PPU ' ammunition needs to be reduced to 7 cartridges loaded for there not to be a problem.)

I'm wondering now if .30-06 ammunition for the M1 Garand might not have tighter dimensional tolerances than general .30-06 ammo ? (I'm not talking about the Garand needing FMJ ammunition for proper feed action but instead thinking about case dimensions.)

What if the gentleman at TR&Z USA Trading Company (the USA importer of PPU ammunition) is correct and their .30-06 150 grain FMJ case dimensions ARE within general .30-06 specifications ? Would that emply that the American Eagle Garand ammuntion (8 rounds load into the Enbloc clip perfectly) is intentionally made with slightly smaller case dimensions than is allowed by the basic .30-06 specifications ?

- Paul