M1903-A1 Springfield Sniper Clone

[Jason60chev]

Hello Milsurpers!

On Dec 7.......how fitting......I got a call from my gunsmith, Bruce Dow, Dade City, Fl....that my Springfield project rifle was complete. After picking it up, I took it to the range to try her out. She performed very well....just wish I could be more steady...even from a bench rest!

Question......Does anyone know how to read the markings on the elevation and windage knobs? The scope is a Lyman Target Spot 8X from the 1930's. I have it dialed in pretty well for 100 yards, but really need to set it up for 300/600 yards for the vintage sniper rifle matches. If you ave any info on reading/setting the sight markings, please holler.

Thanks,
Jason

Information

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[Jim Tarleton]

Jason, you dog, where are the pics of your rifle?

jt

[Rick H.]

I don't have my book with me, but I believe the elevation and windage graduations should be 1/4 inch at 100 yards if your scope bases are 7.2 inches apart. It looks like they are pretty close to that spacing in your picture. If I am wrong I am sure someone else will correct me.

Rick

[Jason60chev]

Jim,

I added a pic to my original post. Did it not come through? Will try again.......Will take some more pics as well........

[Jason60chev]

Jim,

I added a pic to my original post. Did it not come through? Will try again.......Will take some more pics as well........

Here are some more pics of the rifle........SN 1415302....Barrel is Star Gauged (Mark on crown + Alpha-Numeric mark on top ) Date SA 5-32....stock apprears to be Keystone "C" stock....buttplate full checkered but NOT NM plate. Rifle was assembled from acquired + parts on hand.

[Jim Tarleton]

She's a beauty. Do you like that Lyman better than the A5?

jt

[Jason60chev]

The A5 is very difficult to find. The few that did appear on Gun Broker and Ebay got bid up way beyond my reach. I acquired the Lyman Target Spot mounted onto a Mauser target rifle that appeared to have been built up many years ago. Had no use for the rifle, so I sold it at a gun show to the first person who expressed interest in it. That offset the cost to get the scope...which is an 8 Power and can be used in the CMP Vintage Sniper Rifle Match....which is what this whole project is about. For better or for worse, I probably have about $1700 into the rifle...including the work to mount the barrel and drill/tap for the scope bases. It's not an original USMC sniper, but it will do what I want it to do and I don;t think I would part with it.

[Allen Humphrey]

Dang thats nice. Love the wood that isn't too perfect.

[Cosine26]

Here is some trivia on scope molunt block mounting. I believe that the Lyman scope follows the Unertl quite close.
Telescope mounting block spacing
Recently there has been some discussion about mounting and using Unertl, Lyman and Fecker target telescopes of the 30’s, 40’s and 50’s so I thought that I would add my input.
In the 30’s through the 60’s there were two standard mounting distances for the blocks of these telescopes and one non standard. The first was standard mounting distance of 6.86 inches and the second was 7 3/16 inches. The non standard distance was 6.0 inches.
On these scopes the thread of the mounts was 40 tpi so that each revolution of the knob moved the mount 1/40 or 0.025 inch. Using the 6.86 inch distance caused the scopes to move at MOA while the 7 3/16 spacing caused the scope to move in “inches per hundred yards”. The early scope mounts had “clicks” at ½ MOA or ½ inch intervals while the later mounts had clicks at the ¼ increment. For most people in the 30’s who were interested in using the NM ammo, the ½ MOA (6.86) spacing was important so that the standard Army Tables of fire could be used. After WWII the 7 3/16 spacing became popular since NM ammo was not available so that the Army Tables of Fire were not important. The scopes were increasing used on small bore (.22 RF) where the targets were well known in the “inches” measurement. The 6.0 inch measurement was used by those who wanted to mount both blocks on the barrel of the M1903. This dimension gave satisfactory eye relief but the adjustment now was 0.30 inch per hundred yards as opposed to the 0.25 inch per hundred yards. The Model 70 Winchester Bull Gun came with a standard block on the receiver ring, but the front (barrel) mount was elongated and contained notches where the shooter could select either the 6.86 or the 7 3/16 spacing.
All that having been said, most of us rarely used such fine adjustments. Mechanical scope mounts of the day were subject to mechanical error in adjustment. A ¼ click adjustment may or may not move the POA by ¼ inch or MOA. Most of us used the Ted Sloan score books and the 1000 yard target was marked off to show MOA on the target. (So were the other target score sheets). We would just hold off a quarter or a half to make small corrections. I have held as much as 2 minutes. Moving the cross hairs on the target moved the LOS and consequently the LOB while the mechanical adjustments may or may not do so.

In addition, and I probably will be taken to task for this as I already have, we disconnected the recoil spring, not because it was ineffective, but because it was too effective. NOTE: the Lyman scope does nmot have the recoil spring.The popular 1000 yard Bull Guns of the day were usually some flavor of 300 Magnum (H&H, Norma, Winchester, and some wild cats) shooting 180 or 190 grain match bullets ahead of 60+ grains of 4350 or 70+ grains of H4831. (I won’t give the exact loads for these were either DuPont or Hogedon powders of a long gone era and do not equal today’s powders.) Even in a 14 pound Bull Gun the recoil shooting with the cloth 10X jackets was brutal. The Rifle would recoil, while the inertia of the scope would tend to keep it in is spacial position. This would cause the scope to compress the spring which would then drive the scope back into the shooters eye. Not good! After each shot we would reach up and pull the scope back into “battery” using a twisting motion for uniformity. Firing twenty shots first with a scope and then with iron sights was a day’s work. In those days at 1000 yards you were allowed only two sighting shots (if any) followed by twenty shots for record. If you did not hit the paper within the first five record shots you were asked to leave the line.
Just a few comment from an old timer.

[Rick H.]

Thanks Cosine 26. I have used Unertl and Lyman Targetspot scopes for a long time, but you have given me a lot of great information!

Rick H.