Another "treacle rifle" - FTR No.1MKIII*

[Patrick Chadwick]

Thanks Peter. As I said, it seems to be a skilfully implemented piece of work. As it was an Irish rifle, the varnish can hardly have been for protection against tropical climate. So should I strip it off?

[Peter Laidler]

Personally Patrick, I'd have been stripping it off in my head even on the journey home with it! I don't believe that popular myth that varnish protects anything, ESPECIALLY if it's only varnished on the outer surfaces. Like rust, any rot starts where you can't see it. I'm no cabinet maker or wood technologist but have been told that a slight skim of french or button polish is the only laquer type protection that wood appreciates because it's not a cover as such but is a breathable membrane. I would argue that the beeswaxes are as good too because they do the same job! linseed oil has stood the test of time too................

But a nice find none the less.

[jmoore]

Resisting the urge to pull up the plant to see how the roots are growing, I do not wish to dismantle the rifle before a firing test...

Removing the rear handguard ought not disturb anything. Just requires strong fingers to pull straight up after flipping the rear sight leaf out of the way. Usually there's plenty of info above the stock line.

[Frederick303]

Patrick

Of the identified No1 MkIII rifles in my database, not one Irish rifle had a varnish finish. That includes the AM .22 cal rifles, the SMLE MK I rifles, and of course the much disputed No 4 MkII rifles. I have seen rifle that had some much of a buildup of linseed oil that that they had a shiny appearance, but not one rifle when I had it in my hands had an actual varnish coat.

I do not have a copy of it, but some time ago corresponded with a gentlemen who had read the mid 1930s Irish version of the English 1931 armourers manual. According to the gentlemen, the Irish manual was a near copy of the English one, with additional information on the SMLE MK I*** added. It is fair to conclude that the Irish followed English practice, especially as up through WW II they were formally part of the commonwealth.

[Patrick Chadwick]

My guess is based on the markings that it has a replaced 1938 or possibly 1937 barrel date. The barrel will be most likely an Enfield barrel and will also bear a FF in a circle mark.

Frederick, your guess was a 10X.
Of course, since I will not be able to shoot the rifle for another week, I was unable to resist my historical curiosity.

And now I know what an almost new SMLE barrel looks like.
Attachment 36084

The top has the FF, as predicted. And the Enfield "E". Also marked FB31 (Firth Brown Lot 31, I think).
Attachment 36077

And the left side shows a 38 with WD arrow.
Attachment 36080

The right side shows the original number, X-ed out, and the new number applied.
Attachment 36081

There are yet more markings below, but the photo turned out poorly.

B.T.W. the bolt does not have an old number X-ed out, only the new number and the detached P. The Nosecap also only bears the new number and the separate P. It looks as if this was a barrelled system put into an existing rifle (stock, bolt and fore-end) and renumbered to fit. An odd way of doing it. Why not simply renumber bolt and nosecap to match the barrelled system?

There is a "W" in the barrel channel. Probably Wilkinsons Ltd. of Bradford.
Attachment 36079

The magazine slot shows how clean the rifle and all components are on the inside.
Attachment 36083

So the treacle is now coming off!
Attachment 36082
This is now. Next week it will look somewhat different.


Patrick

[lngstrt]

'Mauserland' ... I like that Auch möchte Ich viele Mauser!

Regarding the age of the barrel, when did 'they' stop the FF on rifles?

[P-07ShortLee]

It is definitely an Irish rifle. My guess is based on the markings that it has a replaced 1938 or possibly 1937 barrel date. The barrel will be most likely an Enfield barrel and will also bear a FF in a circle mark.

If the barrel does not bear such a marking, then the barrel will be a post war replacement barrel, which may have no marking at all, or a BSA marking. If BSA it will be dated before 1954.

The above is based on observed markings on Irish rifles; with this rifle I have 78 rifles in the SMLE database.

The varnish is a post service modification.

It seems to have a European proof on the barrel; this is the second one I have in my database. These rifles were all from the final sale of Irish SMLE rifles, which occurred after 1985 and before the end of 1988.

Why 1937 or 1938?

Since you say the undated ones are postwar, does that mean it was rebarreled before ww2?

[Frederick303]

Not trying to be secretive, but based on a data base of sampled rifles it seems to have a feature I have seen exclusively on 1938 re-barreled Irish rifles. I have 78 rifles sampled out of approximately 31,169~31,669 SMLE MK III/II* rifles that were sold between 1961 and 1987, I have only a 0.246 % sample of the rifles. Of course when this feature appeared is not for sure, so there might be some 1937 re-barreled guns with this feature, I simply do not have enough rifles in my sample size to say.

There has been a lot of “conventional knowledge” put out on Irish rifles that has been in error, indeed on some very basic points there is still debate. In order to be more precise I would need to have written verification on some observed data. I do not want to put out information that is incorrect, but once I have all the data verified I am sure I will post the results here or on Gunboards (under the name Fritz)

[Anzac15]

Love seeing those Fianna Fail marked Smellies..always on the lookout for one. Hope to find another at tomorrows gun show. Great find!

[Patrick Chadwick]

...apart from the rear handguard, which I have left for the moment, to show the difference.
Attachment 36351

Alas, the woodwork underneath the treacle is not (yet) beautiful.
Attachment 36350

In fact, I think this was wartime-quality walnut. Grain is OK, no knots, but definitely streaky. Not what you would call grade 1 selected. And scratched, as if some Bubba had removed the finish with a penknife. Maybe that is why a previous owner tried to hide it all under varnish. But the varnished surface is unpleasant to hold, and although the wood is streaky, it is now pleasant to the touch. After all, when shooting, I hold the rifle - I don't look at it.

It has now acquired a sling and a proper P-H target backsight. I need those to test the rifle rather than myself, and the extra sling swivel bracket on the trigger guard was also a secondary reason for buying this rifle, the primary being, of course, the immaculate bore.

As the BDMP Hessen competition for blackpowder firearms is coming up in a few weeks, it may take a while before I can give the Irish Enfield the careful testing it deserves.