Deactivated Mk3 and L4A3 Brens Available

[Peter Laidler]

You still got a Mk3 but an RAF one. Yes, they were the final run of work guns. I will speak later BP

[LesterH]

Any one got an RAF blue Brengun sling.........................?

[Brit plumber]

Our slings (LMG) were just the normal Green/Tan slings, the No.4 drill rifles had blue/grey or white slings but even these were blancod tan slings. I have seen RAF blue slings though, so they do exist.

[Peter Laidler]

I'm not a collector of any sort and especially not of anything that you have to scrub and blanco as the novelty seems to have worn off after a few years of having to do so. But I digress...... I was never aware of there ever being a grey/blue RAF colour sling for the Bren. Rifle, yes, Sterling yes but Sten and Bren, no. But I might be wrong. However, all this absolutely mind blowing stupidity of the Navy having navy blue vehiclesand white webbing etc etc and the RAF having blue/grey vehicles and webbing and the Army having Deep bronze green vehicles and various shades of webbing, depending on which regiment you were with, rightly got the chop by Sir Derek Rayner who was called into look at Admiralty Air Ministry and War Department finances back in the very early 70's.

Can you believe that the various Forces used to pay a premium to acquire commercial vehicles, painted at the factory in a non standard colour like Deep Bronze Green. And then, try to sell them off after 80,000 miles to the public - in a paint scheme that NOBODY wanted! And furthermore, there was not even the remotest possibility that these commercial vehicles, such as cars and mini busses would EVER get within 100 miles of the front line. And the RAF having blue grey webbing and battledress that was camouflaged with absolutely nothing except the sky!!!!! It was ridiculous. But not for long after Rayner got his teeth into it. Thereafter all webbing was issued for land service.

Sorry to go off at a tangent but while I dealt with zillions of various slings, including various shades of khaki, black, dark green and grey/blue, I never saw an RAF grey/blue long Bren sling.

The best stuff I ever had was pattern '44 that we just had to dunk in an old oil drum of warm water and leave to dry. No scrubbing, blanco brass, just as it should be

[Time Bandit]

So, where did the Irish Contract story come from then?

There's obviously a large batch of MK3's just been released and World Wide Arms at least seem to think they are Irish. What is the history of them, sounds like from what Peter is saying they were made for the RAF, but then what happened to them and where did they go?
I'm presuming that the fact they have been released and deactivated means they haven't just come direct from the MoD and if they are ex RAF they must of been sold off by the UK to a third party at some point in time, would they of gone to Ireland then, were they ever even in Ireland? I'm of course presuming that they did indeed come from Ireland using the thought that if WWA bought them, then I'd guess they knew where they had bought them from?

Any more info about them Peter? It sounds like they have bit more history to them than the 'Irish Contract' and bunged into storage for 50 odd years tale?

I'm getting impatient now...hopefully week commencing 9th September should see my MK3 arriving!

[Peter Laidler]

Who knows where they've been? But they were made on contract FOR and issued TO the RAF. Irish contract............ Have you ever heard the phrase '....a load of old b-------'?

[LesterH]

I have seen a few of these "Irish" MK3 Brenguns about. These all seem to be matching number etc and have extending legs bipods. Some others I have seen on sale by Chelmsford and D&B are stamped on some parts P.O.F. But the main bodies are Enfield. These tend to be on sale for £500 to £550. DWSUK have some very nice UE56 MK3 Brenguns for sale. The photographs have the serial numbers on.
I am a member of the VCRAI. When I mentioned I was purchasing an Irish Brengun. Members of the VCRAI posted photographs of the last Bren shoot and confirmed the retirement of the Bren from the PDF in 2006.
It does not worry me where any of my deactivated guns saw service. However what I object to is an advert stating something that is false as an inducement to purchase. My MK3 Brengun is Enfield made. S/N UE55 A3024. If any one has P.O.F.of who this was sold to I will need to know about it. World Wide Arms web site and catalogue definitely states these guns are "Irish Contract". Stories of old boc**ks are one thing. Fraud is another. No one can afford to spend £670 on something that is misdescribed. If I get the proof I am taking this matter up.
Thank you for the help and sharing the information.
Kind regards, Lester

[Peter Laidler]

Look Lester........... I'm going to be as polite as I can be. You bought a Mk3 Bren, made at Enfield in whenever - and guess what you got? Yep............. A Mk3 Bren, made at Enfield in when ever. No one in the whole wide world can tell you where it's been and dealers - and the arms trade in particular are more secretive than the FBI. But I can only tell you that they were originally...........Oh, don't make me repeat it all over and over again. Chill out and enjoy it, even if you can never shoot it

[Kev G]

the last Bren shoot and confirmed the retirement of the Bren from the PDF in 2006.

(IDF,Irish Defence Force ?) One of the last Irish Army Bren shoots was conducted in June 2009 when 31 reserve Cavalry finally retired its Mk3 Brens, 2,500 rounds of .303 ammunition expended in one practise using 6 guns..no stoppages.

I have seen on sale by Chelmsford and D&B are stamped on some parts P.O.F.

These are earlier imported MK3 Brens from Pakistan and nothing to do with the ex-Irish Army Brens.Do not confuse all Brens for sale at a similar time as having come from the same source.

However what I object to is an advert stating something that is false as an inducement to purchase.

Fraud is another.

If I get the P.O.F.I am taking this matter up.

I am in no way conected to WWA's but would advise that you edit some of your statements as this is a public forum and someone might take the matter up with you rather than the other way round.

The ex Irish Army MK3 Brens are well documentated with the importer (not WWA's) for commercial privacy reasons the importer who tendered for them will not be named (by me).

Here is a picture of one still wrapped with Enfield tag.



ATB Kevin

[Peter Laidler]

And if you look at the labels, you'll distinctly see the RAF stores label AND RAF stores 7K- catalogue number! As I said earlier, maybe the RAF used to do a bit of moonlighting for the Irish RAF!

To be honest, 2,500 rounds isn't large 'farewell shoot' by any stretch of the imagination. I'd call that a whimper as opposed to a bang. Consider that we used 40,000 rounds with our Vickers guns