Savage No. 4 (T) Scopeless stamps?

[Roger Payne]

Peter, I've got a BSA 45 receiver in my lap that matches Rob's exactly, including the D6E. The TR has been officially cancelled & I presumed being a 1945 rifle it simply arrived too late to be converted even though it was of the requisite accuracy standard. I have seen or heard of several others. Surpmil's is the only pre-45 example I've heard of. The other two or three were all V or X prefix 1945 rifles. Mine was obviously stripped down at some point but I obtained the body many years ago from our mutual friends at WWA & IIRC it didn't cost me a lot. I have no explanation as to how it acquired the D6E but I am sure as I can be that it is not faked.

If I can ever find my way around my new laptop (Windows 8 - very different to xp & Vista) I'll post pictures. I'll also post some of one of the early H&H conversions that bears the D6E on/near the knox of the barrel - something else that probably shouldn't exist but does occasionally crop up.

[Roger Payne]

Hope these photo's come out.....

[Roger Payne]

Now I'm getting the hang of it here's a couple of the 41 BSA (H&H conversion) with the EFD examiner's mark of D6E positioned just below the knox. I have owned another that was stamped right on the edge of the flat of the knox itself. I know the provenance of the rifles & to be honest the chances of it being fakery are negligible.

Comments on a post card please!

Warren, I couldn't quickly get at my Savage Mk1*T's but my Mk1 T 0C3XX does not bear the P on the rear of the body, but it does have the '1'. Instead of the 'P' it bears a small US flaming grenade mark. It also has the P on the bolt handle as per yours. Afraid I didn't have time to look under the woodwork.

ATB.

[Surpmil]

Roger, that is exactly what I have and while I know I have an old film print of the examiner's marks here somewhere, it's not where I thought it was. I do have a scan of a print of the offside butt socket markings and as you can see I was wrong about the date: it's 1945 and from the X33-34 series of serial number from which a lot of No4(T)s seem to have come. The cancelling mark is exactly as per yours.

Peter, was it written down anywhere that the examiner's mark was to go on last or was that the statement of the chap(s) from H&H who you interviewed?

(I'd post the photo, but the uploader doesn't work for me, again.)

As for the Examiner's mark on the barrel, could that indicate it was put on after the "metal work" was done, but before the rifle was restocked? It would have made little sense to set up the whole rifle and then remove the handguard to stamp the barrel.

Perhaps this indicates that the stocking became part of the inspection after the conversion work had been going on for some time?

I believe that D6E mark has been seen on a few other No4s that have no apparent connection to the No(T) conversion process, but I can't find the photos I hopefully saved of the most recent example, so I can't be sure it was not the E7E mark instead.

[Lee Enfield]

As we are on the subject of Savage snipers, I just wanted to tug on a few coat tails regarding some markings. I noticed these markings when I pulled my Savage No.4(T) off the wall tonight and removed the rear handguard. I'd not noticed these markings before and wondered if others have them on their rifles as so little has been published on the Savage T's.
There is a "P" on the rear of the receiver behind the receiver wall on the right side. Also the P is found on the barrel along with another odd looking broad arrow of a type I have not noticed before on a No.4. Plus another marking (inspector??) that looks like a 1.
The rifle is scoped albeit mismatched, but numbered on the wrist, mount JA marked in a crest and rings with alpha labeling.
The pictures say it all....
Comments gentlemen.
Attachment 48576Attachment 48577Attachment 48578Attachment 48579

The "P" is a Savage marking, which occurs on all of the Savage actions I have, and all of the Savage bolts (some on the back, some on the top); so I don't think it means anything regarding snipers.

The "circled 1" is another story, and doesn't appear on my 1942 "T", but as noted previously I have a 1945 EFD MkI barrel installed.

4Cxxxx No4Mki(T) 1942
55Cxxxx No4MkI*
70Cxxxx No4MkI*
92Cxxxx No4MkI*

[snipershot1944]

US military weapons of the era carry a April proof showing that they were Proof tested. It might be related.

[Peter Laidler]

Re the above............. I just find it incredible. So incredible that I cannot even think offhand of a similar analagy. Like buying a 1960 MGB GT for example. But that's just my view.

[Roger Payne]

Hi Peter, I didn't mean to pee on anyone's cornflakes, far from it, but I've just seen/heard of one or two of these late rifles that were earmarked for conversion but then it was never proceeded with, yet they bear Harry's D6E stamp. Mine bears all of the expected conversion marks except the body side-wall 'T'. Unless any new documentation comes to light we may never have an explanation. Maybe our Harry was a bit of a lad & knew well that his mates had got the conversion process off pat by the dying days of the contracts & so took a chance & stamped up a few in advance so he could have a longer tea break, or 'chat' with the bosses pretty secretary?!?! Human nature is one factor we can't always legislate for (& I must admit off the top of my head I've got no better suggestions)!

ATB

[snipershot1944]

Re my post above. I meant to say "a P proof". Autocorrect is not a good thing some days.

[Brian Dick]

Back to the fact that almost anything is possible and nothing is set in stone!