No. 4 Mk. 2 butt stock gap

[arrowup42]

I recently purchased an unwrapped No.4 Mk 2 and spent today cleaning the cosmoline off the metal. After cleaning it I noticed the gap between the butt and socket is extremely small. I used my feeler gauge and it is about.004 inches at the shoulder and the metal touches the wood at the very bottom. This rifle was taken out of the wrap about 10 years ago and sat untouched in the gentleman's safe until I bought it. I read Peter Laidlers article about correct figment and I'm worried the butt stock is going to crack if fired. Is this something I should try to fix? I still need to clean the stock off with some natural heat in the sunlight and denatured alcohol before applying some BLO. Thanks!

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[tbonesmith]

It doesn't sound like a problem to me. Lots of factory rifles are fitted up very close there and never pose a problem.

[arrowup42]

It doesn't sound like a problem to me. Lots of factory rifles are fitted up very close there and never pose a problem.

The reason I am concerned is because I have another no.4 Mk 2 that has a crack at the bottom of the socket due to the butt stock being in contact with the metal. The stock was actually crushed in where the socket met. However the unwrapped rifle had the tightest butt stock screw I've ever encountered. I'm erring on the side if caution before firing because I'd hate to have the same thing happen to this rifle.

[Peter Laidler]

Being craftsmen, we had to have a series of guides to work to and this was one of 'em! As one of yours has already cracked/chipped away for JUST that very obvious reason, it's a good guide to why we had them. Listen elsewhere if you like, but nearly right ain't good enough. Exactly right is near enough. Proverb on one of the classroom walls. Carlisle, 1963.

In my opinion, unwrapping an Ordnance sealed rifle, sealed from new in 1955 is the biggest mistake. I bet you wouldn't have taken a brand new unused 1965 MGB GT out for a run last week, especially when, if you wanted to take one for a spin you could have chosen from the other million out there! Only my humble opinion.....................

[arrowup42]

Peter I agree and that's the reason why I never unwrapped the one I bought a while ago. However I purchased both the rifles I mentioned from an older gentleman who had already unwrapped one and bought the other in 1994 in very used conditon. I'm looking to have a nice no.4 Mk 2 to be my primary shooter. Would shimming the sides of the buttstock with thick paper make a difference?

[Patrick Chadwick]

In my opinion, unwrapping an Ordnance sealed rifle, sealed from new in 1955 is the biggest mistake. I bet you wouldn't have taken a brand new unused 1965 MGB GT out for a run last week, especially when, if you wanted to take one for a spin you could have chosen from the other million out there! Only my humble opinion.....................

Peter, he acquired the rifle already unwrapped, so nothing lost - apart from some cosmoline

This rifle was taken out of the wrap about 10 years ago and sat untouched in the gentleman's safe until I bought it.

[ssj]

Target shooters did and do indeed shim with paper and varnish to get a very tight fit. My target guns have evidence of this, also 5 or 10thou brass shim is used. The draws also have 3~4mm brass plates on them with brass screws holding them in place, an OZ/ NZ mod though I think. There is a good book by Roger Whitam(?) on accuraising them, about $20 for an electronic copy.

Both my 1954/5 mk2's target 303s also spent many years in a safe, I think that and time dried out the wood and one it recently warped slightly in NZ's sun (so I have to rebed it). So I made the mistake of not I'd linseed oiling them before taking them out for a day's shooting, like not changing the engine oil in an MG I suppose....doh. I'd defer to Peter L but I'd wonder on linseed oil dipping the stock for a period and seeing if it swelled back up to its original dimensions before altering it? Also I have a cheap chip fryer that would fit a rifle butt, maybe fill something like that with linseed oil and let it simmer in hot oil? Peter L is the expert on this sort of thing.

I'd also suggest buying a new butt stock to experiment on first, this is what I have done as the old stocks are stamped with the serial numbers and sold out of service etc so I dont want to ruin their history.

[arrowup42]

I have heard of that and think i will try to make up some shims with varnish. I bought Rodger Wadhams book last year and have it all marked up with the tips and tricks he refers to. He has a tiny paragraph about the butt stock shims. At this point I think the most important step I should take is degreasing the stock as much as possible and treating it with some Organic BLO to see if the wood changes.

Guys I have to admit that as a college senior in his mid twenties I am a little over my head with some of this. If it weren't for my dad and grandfather having Tr 6's and Austin minis I would have no idea what MG's are haha! Thanks for all the advice. I look to this forum and its members for a lot of information on a topic otherwise nearly forgotten by my generation.

[Peter Laidler]

Ah............. target shooters. I've re-read the EMER bible and it didn't mention shims or varnished paper or........... or............ I know it/I might sound facetious but there's only one way to get the correct gap and a tight fit of the butt into the tapered socket and that's to do it properly - once again, that's only my opinion.

And that is to remove the butt, take a file and simply file back the shoulder sufficient for the taper to lock the butt solid into the butt socket while leaving a .025" - .35" or so gap between the butt socked and the shoulder of the butt. It really is that simple. That's what Armourers have been doing since pontious was a pilot

[arrowup42]

Peter, I followed your directions and it worked out perfectly. Thank you! I will wait and see if this needs done to the other one once the weather gets warmer and I can degrease and treat the stock with BLO.

Just out of curiosity, how tight do you tighten the cross screw at the rear of the fore end? I looked in the Canadian manual in the technical knowledge base section and it doesn't mention it. Thanks!