W and F markings on TMH

[Peter Laidler]

Ah, yes, but on the NZ butt frames, they just overbored the hole in the butt frame and inserted and soft soldered a bush into that. Didn't touch the main casing. Heat the main casing unevenly and you wouldn't use the gun again anyway as it'd distort unevenly due to...... many things!

The bayonet standards would knock out very easily with just a mild blow in my experience but it'd leave the reinforcing plate behind. In Malaya/Singapore there was a local EMER instruction that if the bayonet boss was missing then we weren't to Y or ZF the gun as in that theatre or operations the lack of the bayonet fixing facility was of no consequence and the gun was considered serviceable.

But nice SMG's. The Rolls Royce of SMG's in my humble opinion

[tankhunter]

Pete, The L2A3 is one of my Favourite SMGs to fire. I have a 'few' deactivated specimins. Including a VERY rare Fazakerly manufactured Example.
I also own a scratch built Blank Firing Only (Upwards venting!) Sterling which is unfired as of yet!............

In my opinion, a Bayonet on any SMG is useless. More available for Morale Purposes TBH!.. If the Enemy is THAT close that you have to engage with 'The Bayonet'. Then you ARE in Trouble!........

The Sterling WOULD benefit in usage WITHOUT the bayonet lug though. It always bites into the palm of your hand when holding!!.....

As a slight aside. I would LOVE to Own an Aussie F1. But apart from a few in Museums. They all went for the Chop1
I am looking for an illustrated Parts list for the F1 If anyone wants to part with one?

Also, ANY F1 spares. As I would like to construct a replica F1. As getting a genuine / Deact specimen would be well neigh Impossible!...........

[browningautorifle]

I have to agree about the neat little package that was the L2A3 or Sub Machinegun C1. They handled like a nifty light little carbine and shot well. I shot them both for comparison, I had an old L2A3 in the mid '90s. The F1s I handled in Aussie in '77 and knew they were a direct descendant of the Owen. Some of the older men there would have used the Owen too. Didn't know they'd all gone to scrap though...too bad.

[mrclark303]

I would have thought the only place to see an F1 in the UK would be the Pattern room collection Leeds, or perhaps the SASC Warminster Collection, any there Peter?

It would be a very interesting exercise to compare and contrast the commonwealth 1950's SMGs along side each other.

[Peter Laidler]

We didn't have one either. They came into service while I was in Australia and they seemed OK although the old and bold preferred the little Owen. But even then, we were already semi armed with AR15's/M16's which put SMG's in the rifle sections out of business. The masterpiece of the F1 was the virtually unjammable, simple, roller feed, designed by a genius Patchett magazine.

I have got a picture of me crossing a river with one

[mrclark303]

I have a request in at the Royal Armouries Pattern room to "visit" the MP5's in the collection with regard to my ongoing research into my example, (might get there via the L1A1's and F1 if my visit is approved), I will let you know how I get on chaps.

[mrclark303]

Just for fun, here's my old spec deac ex NZ L2A3Attachment 65188Attachment 65187Attachment 65186

[Peter Laidler]

My old boss gave the final seal of approval for those guns for the NZ Army.

[desperatedan]

I've got an old spec deact Sterling that's a "US..." numbered example rather than the more commonly seen "KR" prefixed ones. I imagine not as rare as a Faz made "UF..." example though.....

[Peter Laidler]

That's quite rare as it's a Sterling gun made for the UK Military. They got a small order for nefarious reasons. Notice that the designation, the identifier (that's the US part of the number) and the MoS/VAOS number B3/CR 53GA are all lightly roll stamped. Whereas the actual serial number part A-5725 is deeply engraved. Sterling did this so that to obliterate a serial number would damage the magazine housing and make such an act obvious.