Lee Enfield No.1 Mk3 H 1917 Information?

[Montty]

Hey guys,

I have recently acquired a 1917 Lee Enfield No.1 Mk3 H rifle in very good condition. I am after as much information as possible on the rifle and im hoping you guys may be able to guide me on its rarity(If at all)?

(Please see the attached Photos for specifics on the questions.)
Some features of the rifle include:

• All matching serial numbers, this includes breech, bolt, stock and nose cone.
  
• On the under side of the nose cone is the letter "B".
  
• On the under side of the front wood appears "SLAZ 43" with matching serial number and the letter "B".
  
• Butt stock has matching serial number with a "4" on top divided by a dash mark.
  
• On the butt stock of the rifle 3 distinctive marks appear "3/45", "HV", an "S" with a broad arrow underneath and a shield with a star above it that we cannot identify.
  
• On top of the nob of the barrel appear "11 H 53".
  
• On the right side of the barrel appears 3 stars with the letter "A" inside and below them are the roman numeral "I", "II", "III".
  
• On the left side of the barrel appears "8/47" aswell as 2 broad arrows.
  
• There is a No.4 Central sight plate fitted Patent dated "12-11-35" and "3-12-36".
  
• There are many other markings aswell.

Please post below if you have any information on these markings, general comments on the rifle or require anymore information or photos.

Thanks guys,
Montty.

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[muffett.2008]

Beside the normal Lithgow markings, there is one very nice addition on the Knocks Form "Pat Lee".
Pat was a target shooter from Albury, in the 1930's he was one of the top shots in Australia, a Multiple KINGS winner, Bisley team member and bloody nice guy.
His son, Ken Lee, followed in his footsteps, I have the honour of being one of his friends and shooting with him for many years until his death, sadly missed, they both were natures gentlemen.

So there is a possibility that this rifle was used by the great man, cannot see the overstamped name, but it may have been a Taylor or Mottey barrel, or maybe the rifle was setup by Pat for someone, but I'd rather my initial summation were the correct one, I'd love to add that to my collection, along with some of the other great named shooters ..............oh yeah, nice rifle.

[Bindi2]

The 4 is for the fourth Military District. 3/45 was when the rifle returned to stores. HV means it has been converted to shoot Mk7 ammo. The S within the Broad arrow is sold out of service stamp. The Shield is the Lithgow ID stamp. 8/47 is when the barrel was made. SLAZ 43 is the wood makers stamp and date when made.

[Montty]

Thank you very much for the replies guys, alot of useful information there.

That information was great Muffett.2008, it has spiked my interest, and i am very interested to find more out about it. Is there any direction you could point me or further information you could provide?

My father and I purchased this rifle because it looked like a good buy for service shooting as that is what we spend most of our time doing, we do some collecting but we dont have any real experience with a name linked rifle such as this.

So what we understand from what your saying Muffett is that most likely it is a Lithgow 1917 No.1 Mk3 H that was refurbished by Lithgow for Pat Lee but they installed an after market barrel and still applied the standard Lithgow markings?

If so, was the refurbishment most probably done in 1953?

If it adds anything to the story the rifle came from Wagga wagga.

Thanks Bindi2 for the in depth description of the markings, I will update the original post with the info when I get a chance for other peoples quick reference. But before that two quick questions.

Firstly, Why is there two dates on the barrel? is "8/47" the barrel date and "11 53" the rifle refurbishment date? if so i have never seen a date on the knock of the barrel like that?

Secondly, by the "3/45" date are you referencing that as returning to military storage or taken out of service for sale? If still in military stores would you presume it was re-barreled while in service?

Thanks for the info guys its really appreciated.
Montty.

[Bindi2]

3/45 is when the rifle went into store after being checked out or repaired.
11/53 is when the H barrel was fitted most likely by a gunsmith/EX armourer at the State Rifle Shooting Association for range use after it had been sold out of service.

[muffett.2008]

If it has a H imprinted in the timber at the top of the buttstock, it is a 1917 converted to No.1 Mk.III H in 1933/34 as part of a special NRAA purchase, if not, than it is just a 1917 converted for target use.
It would have been a Club issue or private purchase until 1941, when it was called in during the Impressment period.

If it was an issue H rifle, it would be complete with service rearsight, but as most target shooters removed them in order to use target sights, it would have been fitted up with the Central Ertzats sight, or one of the impressed Central Bisley, or Mues Kings sights, and relegated to second line use.

It was refurbished in 3/45 and either returned to it's original owner if known, or sold out of service to a rifle club member (when rifles were originally impressed a compensation payment was made, but as over 43,000 rifles were handed in, the Commonwealth ceased these payments and the rifles were returned post war.)

As rifle club members fired a lot of rounds in practice and competition, top shooters replaced barrels on a regular basis, your rifle would have been rebarreled several times, 1917, 33/34 with an H barrel, 1945 to return to owner or Club, and again in 8 /47.

The stamp 11.......53 tells me that it was accurised by one of the major Gunsmithing outlets, most likely Edwards and Motton, the stamp being consistant with ones I have.

Pat Lee was in his twenties when he won his first Kings in 1936, his son Ken hit his straps in 1950 shooting for Mosman/Neautral Bay.