Irish Army Bren Mag Tin

[tankhunter]

As a matter of little interest, the price of Bren box in 1965 was £2:50p and a magazine £2:10p. A tripod £25, blank firing barrel £11:25p And a simple bipod, £12.

Ill take x 100 of the tripods at that Price please Pete!.... LOL

The mags haven't gone up much since then. The 'Standard' price for a .303" Mag these days is £3-£5 pounds on the Collectors circuit!

[Peter Laidler]

I found a long list of prices in my desk drawer, left there by previous EME's. These were the NM&D* prices relevant to kit likely to be lost or damaged. Those prices strayed pretty constant until 1974 when it was advised to add 10% to them. A No2 Browning was £22, L2A3 SMG £29, L1A1 rifle £80, No2 .38 revolver £24, Mk5 Sten £7, .38" S&W (RAF only) £18.
NM&D = neglect, misuse and damage caused by user and confirmed after the relevant enquiries

[Flying10uk]

Currently there is a 7.92mm Bren mag tin for sale on e-bay of a style which I haven't seen before and the listing describes it as of the style supplied to the Resistance in WW2. It appears to have a raised lip around the edge of the lid on the outside and on the inside both rows of devisions for holding the mags in place are attached to the base of the tin. I, unfortunately, don't have the computer skills to add a link from this post to the e-bay listing. I wasn't aware that 7.92mm Brens were supplied to the Resistance?

[Peter Laidler]

There is indeed a LOT of doubt about these so called '....resistance' Brens.

[Flying10uk]

Is there any-one with better computer skills than myself who could provide a link from this thread to the e-bay listing please; obviously the Bren mag tin is located with the Bren listings on e-bay. Thanks.

[ZGB]

Sorry FLYING10UK when i said ZB i meant CESKOSLOVENSKA ZBROJOVKA factory in the CEZCH REPUBLIC. Each gun they sent to IRELAND, supplied through the WAR OFFICE had a 12 mag tin and a 6 mag half tin that included the loader, combi tool etc. All of which were manufactured in the CEZCH REPUBLIC.
The other mag tin marked M202 with the strange stock number in black was one of a batch that was sourced in BELGIUM by interarms back in the late 80's early 90's.

[Flying10uk]

Did the Irish Army use their 6 mag tins as what I call "Grab Tins" i.e. intended to be carried in a vehicle and if the vehicle was hit then when then crew bailed out, hopefully, they took the tins with them? Or were they simply intended as a easier/lighter tin to be carried by infantry? I have seen some WW2 versions of the 6 mag tin installed in a vehicle as a "Grab Tin" and if memory serves me correctly it was a Canadian vehicle and tins (aluminium?).

[Peter Laidler]

The section commander will decide how he wants the section ammunition carried and distributed after the briefing with the platoon commander having regard to the operation. There's no hard and fast rules. In real life, it'll be the platoon Sgts who 'advise' the junior (but senior in rank) platoon commanders. Sentry Duty? BAR? Muffer?

[Sentryduty]

The section commander will decide how he wants the section ammunition carried and distributed after the briefing with the platoon commander having regard to the operation. There's no hard and fast rules. In real life, it'll be the platoon Sgts who 'advise' the junior (but senior in rank) platoon commanders. Sentry Duty? BAR? Muffer?

Agreed, every section distribution of equipment and ammunition will vary day to day, mission to mission.

During my time, generally the logic was something like this in a typical 10 man section:

The Light Machine Gunners have the greatest load to bear with their gun and ammunition, in modern times this is a C9 LMG, spare barrel, cleaning/parts kit, and 3x 200 round belt boxes for a basic total of 600 rounds of 5.56 link, 4BIT (4 ball, 1 tracer... 4-BIT) we have two of those guys per section. In peacetime these are generally the newest soldiers to the army/section, in operations these guys is are senior/well skilled soldiers as the Infantry Section in battle is reliant on machine guns for effectiveness. If a gunner goes down, our aim is drop whatever you are doing and get that gun back in the fight at nearly any cost. Nearest rifleman becomes the gunner. For note the C9 LMG is considered a personal weapon, meaning no pistol, or other means of protection is issued, and the weapon is fully operated by the gunner, that means loading, feeding, shooting, ammunition carriage etc is done by a single person.

From there we have Grenadiers/M203 Gunner (unofficial titles) that is a C7 Rifle with M203A1 Grenade Launcher, this requires the carry of front line ammo loadout plus typically 18 rounds of 40mm HE LV (High Explosive, Low Velocity) so they typically don't have much extra assigned.

The remainder is 4x riflemen to include the section commander (I/C) and his 2nd (2 I/C). The I/C and 2 I/C may or may not be equipped with C8 carbines, availability and personal preference to dictate.

Since these 4 guys have the "lightest load" they will become the mules of the section, carrying junk to facilitate the LMG's and Grenade launchers to stay in the fight the longest. Between these 4 guys, additional ammo and stores such as radio batteries, will be carried. The basic 1200 round of linked ammunition is nothing to feed two LMG's, this is embarrassing, but I cannot recall rapid rate of fire, BAR will correct me here, but 600 rounds/gun does not keep them fed during a protracted battle, so we try to pack as much as ammo as possible. Generally two spare boxes of 4BIT per gun, so a total of 1000 rounds per gun.

And....

A single section does not act alone, we have 3 fighting sections per platoon, and the head quarters section. The HQ section will have a manpack radio (or 2 if Sat radios are in use) a weapons detachment with C6 Machine gun team, a 60mm mortar, and the 84mm Carl Gustav, (possibly the ERYX, but we won't talk about that heap) .The weapons det will hump a good amount of their own ammo, but extras must be carried, and that will fall to the sections. Things can get loaded down enough where a C9 gunner (remember I said he had the greatest load above) is tasked with carrying 2 mortar bombs and a couple claymores, and things can get to the point where you are damn happy you had dragged that extra weight to keep the weapons det rocking in times of need.