Vietnam clone...”The Shillelagh“

[AmEngRifles]

So, I had been gathering the parts, Fulton Armory virgin receiver, cut down contract barrel, round bolt, trigger frame, etc. to build a retro Viet Nam era carbine whippet, when an Inland “Advisor” presented itself at a very good price. Snapped it up and knew right away where it was going to end up. I hate the stock on the Advisor as comes from Inland. So a perfect match!

Now, what am I going to do with a second pistol or whippet carbine!?

Still need to oil the stock or finish somehow, but left it for now so you can see the mods more clearly. Wait! Can’t post pictures via cell phone!? Will get them posted soon.

Decided to name it “The Shillelagh“ as it seems appropriate.

Information

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[AmEngRifles]

OK< finally got the pictures uploaded and sized. I will be, at minimum, hitting the whole stock with linseed oil. Will see how the light spots blend? Not sure what I would stain those areas with them to and match the old finish, which is heavily sanded now.

The stock for this project was a GB buy of a stock with a really horrible butt end. It had cracks, staples and really needed to be removed from the rest of the stock, so it was PERFECT for this little project. Added a couple of pics from the Internet that inspired the piece.

The guys in Viet Nam had to rework rifles, but today we have pistol forms of the carbine. Although I do recall, sometime during the 70's, the commercial carbine manufacturers started to come out with their pistol versions, the Enforcer. Guess that had been inspired by those modifications being done In Country.

When the thing runs out of bullets, you can grab it by the barrel end and give a good whack with the knob at the opposite end. :-)

[RASelkirk]

With the short barrel and no stock extension, would this be considered a pistol?

Russ

[AmEngRifles]

RAS, yes, exactly. They are built with NEW receivers AS pistols from day one, so it is legal to build something like this. If all we had were M1 carbine rifles, could not be done without going the NFA route.

The pistols of the 70's had various barrel retention designs, but pretty much, none of them used the typical G.I. barrel band. The newer Inland company is now making a pistol version they call the "Advisor", based on pistol as illustrated from the Viet Nam era images.

I have a Fulton Armory carbine receiver that came to me as only a receiver, so it is also legal to build into a pistol, short barrel, chopped stock and all. I was on my way to finishing that one when an Advisor presented itself for about half their listed retail. Much better buy at well under 1k. I really wonder how they sell at nearly $1,300.00 retail?? Too much in my opinion.

[browningautorifle]

I had an enforcer many years ago and after wanting it for so long didn't have it long. A friend needed it so away it went. They're neat...mine was the 9" Bbl, ventilated handguard like yours.

[DaveHH]

shot one of these things in Vietnam. It was a weapon owned by one of our chopper pilots. The Guy in the right hand photo is wearing a I FFV (First Field Force) patch. Infantry from 50th Inf., Ist Cav, 4th, 25th . My outfit when I was leaving. You could hit someone if you were locked in a closet with the guy.

[AmEngRifles]

Dave, apologies for words in mouth, but did you intend to say "couldn't hit someone in a closet"?

I also have what I refer to as the "Swcharzkopf" model, i.e., same gun but registered SBR with a M1A1 M1 carbine repro stock attached.

They are definitely close in sticks. I find I do ok with them, but they are on the wild side. Not a precision weapon at all. A 25 yard weapon, maybe 50 yards if I aim true and squeeze gently. :-)

Dave, would you say they (the chopped carbine versions) were prevalent among U.S. Forces, or just kind of an oddity? Was that a stop-gap weapon prior to the XM177E1's coming to the troops? Was it the impetus for the XM-177E1's ?? I don't think anybody was doing this to carbines during WWII?

[rcathey]

I also have what I refer to as the "Swcharzkopf" model, i.e., same gun but registered SBR with a M1A1 M1 carbine repro stock attached.

The pistol, while neat, didn't rev my engine too much....
But the one with the stock is TOO COOL. I NEED!

[old tanker]

Dave, apologies for words in mouth, but did you intend to say "couldn't hit someone in a closet"?

I also have what I refer to as the "Swcharzkopf" model, i.e., same gun but registered SBR with a M1A1 M1 carbine repro stock attached.

They are definitely close in sticks. I find I do ok with them, but they are on the wild side. Not a precision weapon at all. A 25 yard weapon, maybe 50 yards if I aim true and squeeze gently. :-)

Dave, would you say they (the chopped carbine versions) were prevalent among U.S. Forces, or just kind of an oddity? Was that a stop-gap weapon prior to the XM177E1's coming to the troops? Was it the impetus for the XM-177E1's ?? I don't think anybody was doing this to carbines during WWII?

Carbines were plentiful in Viet Nam and most of the ones I saw were M2 carbines. Most of the troopers who had them obtained them through unofficial sources. Since you were not "signed" for it, chopping them was usually undertaken by whoever first acquired it. Some of the barrels I saw were crudely hack saw cut, far from square and uncrowned. Dispersion for "area fire" was built in.

I suspect their apparent popularity with helicopter pilots stemmed from a lack of confidence in the volume of fire they could obtain from the .38 special revolver and the pipsqueak M41 cartridge they were issued.

[DaveHH]

Carbines were plentiful in Viet Nam and most of the ones I saw were M2 carbines. Most of the troopers who had them obtained them through unofficial sources. Since you were not "signed" for it, chopping them was usually undertaken by whoever first acquired it. Some of the barrels I saw were crudely hack saw cut, far from square and uncrowned. Dispersion for "area fire" was built in.

I suspect their apparent popularity with helicopter pilots stemmed from a lack of confidence in the volume of fire they could obtain from the .38 special revolver and the pipsqueak M41 cartridge they were issued.

One of the things that you had to get used to was the sound of choppers. Practically 24 hrs a day you could hear that "whop-whop". There were a lot of them and a lot of pilots. I'd say that at least half were not being used in inserting and extracting maneuver infantry. We had about four in my signal battalion. They were like a taxicab around II Corps. Our pilots were all officers Majors down, No WOs. These guys just had weapons in the birds. Some of these, some of that. Nobody wanted to come down outside Pleiku without at least a 45. One night the VC got inside the wire and blew up a couple of the $150K toys.
Carbines were everywhere. Most were in PF, Nungs, ARVNs and Koreans had a lot of them. I personally always felt that the beauty of a rifle or carbine was to be able to pick off bad guys at 100 yds and out. We did a lot of convoy type stuff and it was flat country on HWY1. That M14 was the cat's meow out of a truck.