+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Winchester P-14, seeking its history

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #1
    Member Noobtubes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:18 AM
    Location
    Lebanon, OR
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    10:33 AM

    Winchester P-14, seeking its history

    Hi all, 'tubes here with my crown jewel that I'm hoping for y'all's opinion on: I have a winchester p-14 and bayonet that I came by as a pair some time ago, and its one of the only WW1 era firearms i've ever had that looks to be in its original state. I've thoroughly taken it apart and found Winchester marks on everything except the volley-sight plate and rear sight which are eddystone marked, and the stock, which has what may be a W on the front but scratches make it hard to make out. The handguard is obviously marked W and the wear pattern and patina are identical to the stock so they appear to be a matching set. The barrel and receiver match and the bore sparkles. It has a stock plug where I assume it once had a unit disk, is that necessarily evidence that it was issued for combat. This old girl has the most wonderful patina and i swear there are 4 small indentations in the right finger groove that feel like finger wear marks.

    The bayonet may be the original issued but the person who sold it to me didn't know. Its a winchester mfg. pattern 13 bayonet marked "4-16" on the blade and the hilt has a unit marking: "308 2.6 A.S.H." and has a correct scabbard. It seems to me unlikely that these two met post-war but I guess its always possible.

    I know that the Britishicon preferred winchester P-14's for actual combat but that their use was relatively rare. Anyone got any knowledge that could help shed light on this rifle's story?


    Winchester P-14 - Album on Imgur

  2. # ADS
    Friends and Sponsors
    Join Date
    October 2006
    Location
    Milsurps.Com
    Posts
    All Threads
    Banner AD Space Available - Click HERE to Inquire We specialise in military utensils and artefacts such as helmets, daggers, medals and badges, etc.  The on-line store is intended for personal browsing and searching of collecting objects. All items are provided historical value only and can be used for home collection or other purposes except of fascism, Nazism or other extremism manifestation or its propaganda. LIMITED TIME OFFER FROM THE AMERICAN GUNSMITHING INSTITUTE: Get Immediate Online Access To AGI's NEW Armorer's Course for Glock Pistols, Covering Every Generation of Glocks, Including the Latest Model 42/43 and Double Stack Pistols for ONLY $7.00! Brian Dick ... BDL Ltd. - Specializing in British and Commonwealth weapons Chuck in Denver ... Buy-Sell-Trade .. Guns, Cars Motorcycles We pride ourselves on being the new lowest price listing service, and the simplest to use. If you need to buy or sell collectible firearms or any firearm in your legal possession, then this is the place for you. If you’re a big collector clearing house, or other seller that could benefit from a Premium seller account, then we can also support you here at Gunonline.com. Your source for the finest in High Power Competition Gear. Here at T-bones Shipwrighting we specialise in vintage service rifle: re-barrelling, bedding, repairs, modifications and accurizing. We also provide importation services for firearms, parts and weapons, for both private or commercial businesses.
     

  3. #2
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    Today @ 02:02 PM
    Location
    Victoria BC
    Posts
    22,362
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    11:33 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Noobtubes View Post
    The bayonet may be the original issued
    That's not really possible as after 100 years...even after 6 months they would be swapped. Anyone that has been issued can attest. There was no issue of rifle with bayonet, they came as a list and came out a separate shipment crate.

    Love to see pics though, always nice to see these. Also easier to figure out if we can see them.
    Regards, Jim

  4. Avoid Ads - Become a Contributing Member - Click HERE
  5. #3
    Member Noobtubes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:18 AM
    Location
    Lebanon, OR
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    10:33 AM
    Thread Starter
    Haha sorry I didn't mean original issued I meant potentially originally in service with the same unit, but I guess if they were packed away separately there is really no telling.

  6. Thank You to Noobtubes For This Useful Post:


  7. #4
    Really Senior Member oldfoneguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Last On
    Today @ 02:32 PM
    Location
    long island, ny
    Posts
    213
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    02:33 PM
    It would be impossible to verify as bayonets were handed out from a crate down the line from where you were handed the rifle. Also keep in mind that there were no Eddystone bayonets as they never passed the Britishicon inspectors requirements. So all Eddystones would have to have a Winchester or Remington bayonet which would make a true purests head explode. If you could find the roles that would identify what bayonet was issued with which rifle you'd become a very rich man with the ability to answer 100's of thousands of questions!

  8. Thank You to oldfoneguy For This Useful Post:


  9. #5
    Contributing Member Promo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Last On
    Today @ 03:41 AM
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    1,338
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    08:33 PM
    Are you really located in Lebanon? If yes, are you aware if the P.14 rifle saw usage in Lebanon and were they marked with the Cedar in a circle? Thank you!

    Edit: Err ... never mind. Didn't consider that there is a location in the US named after a particular country ....

  10. #6
    Member Noobtubes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:18 AM
    Location
    Lebanon, OR
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    10:33 AM
    Thread Starter
    Haha gotcha! and no cedar in a circle on mine.

    ---------- Post added at 02:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:00 PM ----------

    That makes sense, is anyone familiar with the bayonet's unit marking though?

  11. #7
    Advisory Panel Brian Dick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Last On
    Today @ 01:37 PM
    Location
    Edgefield, SC USA
    Posts
    3,574
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    02:33 PM
    Argyle and Sutherland Highlanders

  12. Thank You to Brian Dick For This Useful Post:


  13. #8
    Member Noobtubes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:18 AM
    Location
    Lebanon, OR
    Posts
    16
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    10:33 AM
    Thread Starter
    SO I did some digging and here's the unit history for the marking on the bayonet, they were a second-line unit that stayed at home during the great war.

    2/6th (Renfrewshire) Battalion Territorial Force
    Sept 1914 Formed at Paisley and then moved to Falkirk as part of the 193rd Brigade of the 64th Division.
    Autumn 1915 Moved to Forfarshire.
    08.11.1915 Became the No. 10 Battalion.
    Mar 1916 Resumed identity and moved to Norwich.
    April 1917 Moved to Taverham and then Norwich.
    Mar 1918 Left the 64th Division.
    13.03.1918 Disbanded.

    source: Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders - Regiment History, War Archives

    Slightly disappointing as I'm trying to collect guns that did but it is still a cool piece of history and a phenomenal shooter: With a competent marksman working her she can hit a head-sized target at 475 meters off the battle sight easily. Its also kind of a cool connection because the Argyle & Sutherland highlanders are headquartered at sterling castle which I've actually been to. I think my best bets for getting a real war veteran in shootable original condition will be to get an early m1917 or no1 mk III.

  14. #9
    Really Senior Member oldfoneguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Last On
    Today @ 02:32 PM
    Location
    long island, ny
    Posts
    213
    Local Date
    10-22-2019
    Local Time
    02:33 PM
    Finding a P14 used in combat will be akin to finding a unicorn. From the very beginning the parts interchangeability relegated the P14 to second line units. The only chance one was used in combat is if one of those 2nd line units were attacked and that would be extremely specific and hard to prove.



    Your correct in your assumption that a NoI MkIII or a M1917 would be a better bet as a combat veteran.

+ Reply to Thread

Similar Threads

  1. Seeking information on stock markings on newly acquired Winchester M1917
    By M1A in forum Pattern 1913/1914 and M1917 Rifles
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 05-07-2019, 06:45 PM
  2. Winchester 1897 Trench gun. Identification/History
    By superhero in forum Military Shotguns
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 07-21-2018, 10:01 PM
  3. seeking someone in the uk
    By rooster in forum Q&A - MILSURPS.COM
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 08-10-2014, 02:26 PM
  4. CSP is seeking advertisers
    By Jeff L in forum M16A2/AR15A2 Rifles
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-07-2009, 02:38 PM
  5. CSP is seeking advertisers
    By Jeff L in forum Range Reports - Show us how good you are!
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-07-2009, 08:07 AM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts