Pictures of Surviving Monte Carlo-butted Lee-Enfields with C No. 67 Mk.I Scopes?

[Hideyoshi]

Afternoon everyone.

Just wondering if anyone here has got pictures of surviving examples of the Long Branch No. 4 Mk. I(T)*s which sported the Monte Carlo buttstock with Jostam Anti-Flinch rubber recoil pad and C No. 67 Mk. I scope. I need them for some future graphical work I’ll might be doing. So far, I could only saw a pair of pictures of it which Badger uploaded in this post: https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=46513&page=3. I also saw a few from Colin Stevens example, which, IIRC, has got a buttstock a bit different from the ones which saw action during Korea.

Any photos would be good, although of full rifles would be excellent.

Thanks in advance.

[Lee Enfield]

]

Afternoon everyone.

Just wondering if anyone here has got pictures of surviving examples of the Long Branch No. 4 Mk. I(T)*s which sported the Monte Carlo buttstock with Jostam Anti-Flinch rubber recoil pad and C No. 67 Mk. I scope. I need them for some future graphical work I’ll might be doing. So far, I could only saw a pair of pictures of it which Badger uploaded in this post: https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=46513&page=3. I also saw a few from Colin Stevens example, which, IIRC, has got a buttstock a bit different from the ones which saw action during Korea.

Any photos would be good, although of full rifles would be excellent.

Thanks in advance.

I know 4 people with complete "C.No.67" snipers. Other than Colin, none of them are willing to allow photos to be published.

Colin's stocks are both incorrect, the stock on his 80L is a repro, the stock on his trials rifle is a commercial sporter.

A couple of clarifications:

1. The SAL (Small Arms Limited) trials rifles (various scopes and mounts trialed - mostly variations of the 45* "REL mount" [improved Griffin & Howe] adopted for the "No32MkI TP" scopes) used 1 type of Pistol Grip/cheek-piece stock, the "production" C.No67MkI rifles were equipped with a 2nd type "production" stock (best description is "clunkier").

2. NONE of the "C.67" stocks used actual Jostam pads. The "Jostam style" "C.67" pad is made by SAL. They are a clear rubber like material dyed black.

3. The trials rifles stocks used a --edited out-- commercial pad (again, not a Jostam).

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[bros]

I have some pictures in my inventory of the above mentioned rifle.....it's not mine so if I get permission to post them you will see them here on this thread.

[Hideyoshi]

]

I know 4 people with complete "C.No.67" snipers. Other than Colin, none of them are willing to allow photos to be published.

Colin's stocks are both incorrect, the stock on his 80L is a repro, the stock on his trials rifle is a commercial sporter.

A couple of clarifications:

1. The SAL (Small Arms Limited) trials rifles (various scopes and mounts trialed - mostly variations of the 45* "REL mount" [improved Griffin & Howe] adopted for the "No32MkI TP" scopes) used 1 type of Pistol Grip/cheek-piece stock, the "production" C.No67MkI rifles were equipped with a 2nd type "production" stock (best description is "clunkier").

2. NONE of the "C.67" stocks used actual Jostam pads. The "Jostam style" "C.67" pad is made by SAL. They are a clear rubber like material dyed black.

3. The trials rifles stocks used a --edited out-- commercial pad (again, not a Jostam).

Attachment 102329Attachment 102330Attachment 102328

Hello Lee Enfield, and thank you for replying.

I know surviving examples of said rifle are very, very scarce, so I can understand why their owners are very reluctant to post or allow to post any photos.

I noticed the differences between both types of stock, the ones used during tests, which look like classic sporters, including checkering on the grip,and the ones used for "production", which seem to me like a more solid and robust type (no checkering), suitable for battlefield use. My only sources for this are Sam's Sloppy Sniper Section, and Without Warning.

I certainly didn't know the pads weren't Jostam (I vaguely recall reading somewhere some or most pads were, and couldn't find any other source stating otherwise). The pads you mention seem to me either a cost-saving alternative to commercial pads(if they thought they were suitable for service), or, less likely, an improvement over commercial designs. I'm most interested about this. Can you list any source(s) about these pads? Perhaps there was further research/development, and this could help me.

Thanks for the information, appreciate it.

---------- Post added at 11:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:42 PM ----------

I have some pictures in my inventory of the above mentioned rifle.....it's not mine so if I get permission to post them you will see them here on this thread.

Hey bros, and thanks for replying.

Hope the owner of the rifle allows the photos to be posted, would love to see them.

Cheers.

[mrclark303]

I have some pictures in my inventory of the above mentioned rifle.....it's not mine so if I get permission to post them you will see them here on this thread.

I await with great interest, it would be very interesting to see....

[Brian Dick]

Buy a copy of "The Lee Enfield" by Skennerton and/or "Without Warning" by Law. They have all the pictures of original rifles you need.

[bros]

I have some pictures in my inventory of the above mentioned rifle.....it's not mine so if I get permission to post them you will see them here on this thread.

I have emailed the pictures to Browningautorifle .......Jim has always been gracious to help me in the past with posting pictures, I don't know why this time it would be any different so "heads up" hopefully some incoming.
I took these pictures a while ago and did receive permission to post them with owners request to remain anonymous. Sorry if I had known I was going to post them to this forum I would have taken many more and better detailed pictures......but at least we have a couple to look at. Again my apologies for the one of the "top view" of the scope is blurry. I will be able to take more in the future possibly but don't hold your breath waiting, that means another visit........ that will not be able till at least around Christmas. As far as any additional info beyond having the pictures, that's all I have at the moment. I may be able to ask a specific question and await owners input but for now just enjoy what you see.

[Lee Enfield]

Hello Lee Enfield, and thank you for replying.

I know surviving examples of said rifle are very, very scarce, so I can understand why their owners are very reluctant to post or allow to post any photos.

I noticed the differences between both types of stock, the ones used during tests, which look like classic sporters, including checkering on the grip,and the ones used for "production", which seem to me like a more solid and robust type (no checkering), suitable for battlefield use. My only sources for this are Sam's Sloppy Sniper Section, and Without Warning.

I certainly didn't know the pads weren't Jostam (I vaguely recall reading somewhere some or most pads were, and couldn't find any other source stating otherwise). The pads you mention seem to me either a cost-saving alternative to commercial pads(if they thought they were suitable for service), or, less likely, an improvement over commercial designs. I'm most interested about this. Can you list any source(s) about these pads? Perhaps there was further research/development, and this could help me.

Thanks for the information, appreciate it.[COLOR="black"]

...snip....

Like with most things, governments tend to prefer to own production & guarantee supplies when they can.

The short answer is that if a "C.67" stock has a red Jostam pad on it, it's been replaced. That is a great indicator of originality.

There are no photos (that I know of) of original rifles with Jostam pads - though they (SAL) must have had at least one to copy.

The trials stocks had a 1940s contemporary commercially available pad - yes we know what it was, but I've been asked not to publish the info.

I posted photos of a real grip cap, that's something else you won't find any photos of.
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[Hideyoshi]

Buy a copy of "The Lee Enfield" by Skennerton and/or "Without Warning" by Law. They have all the pictures of original rifles you need.

Hello Brian, and thanks for the reply.

I already got my hands on a copy of Without Warning last year, and the information was on point, pictures were great, and I got to see the rare 5-power R.E.L. experimental scope in more detail (something I wanted since I've known of these rifles). I'm planning to get Skennerton's The Lee Enfield this year to have even more material for research. I'm looking this time for color pictures, hence why I'm asking here for ones of surviving examples.

Cheers.

[Hideyoshi]

Like with most things, governments tend to prefer to own production & guarantee supplies when they can.

The short answer is that if a "C.67" stock has a red Jostam pad on it, it's been replaced. That is a great indicator of originality.

There are no photos (that I know of) of original rifles with Jostam pads - though they (SAL) must have had at least one to copy.

The trials stocks had a 1940s contemporary commercially available pad - yes we know what it was, but I've been asked not to publish the info.

I posted photos of a real grip cap, that's something else you won't find any photos of.

Hello again Lee Enfield, thanks for replying.

It's now clear to me "production" rifles didn't sport Jostams but S.A.L.-made pads (again, I'm truly interested on these pads and others the company may have developed, and I'd be grateful if anyone could provide any source).

Thanks most for the grip cap picture, I didn't know it had checkering.

Cheers.