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Thread: the Ishapore 2's 7.62x51

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  1. #21
    Advisory Panel Brian Dick's Avatar
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    Guys who are serious shooters that want a 7.62 Lee Enfield should buy or build one on a No.4 action that isn't worn out. Even then, you're stressing them to the max so you must adhere to the military specification pressures. Those who want to push 168 and heavier projectiles at M118LR velocity, (yes, I've seen and repaired the results once. He was lucky.), are beating their old rifles to death. Stick with the 155 grain Palma Match SMK and you should be fine.

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    Contributing Member 30Three's Avatar
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    Brian, is the Forster gauge for 7.62 NATO suitable for checking headspace in the L39?
    I assume it would be dificult to find an original armorer's headspace gauge for the L39 and L42 these days.

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    Really Senior Member Alan de Enfield's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Dickicon View Post
    Guys who are serious shooters that want a 7.62 Lee Enfield should buy or build one on a No.4 action that isn't worn out. Even then, you're stressing them to the max so you must adhere to the military specification pressures. Those who want to push 168 and heavier projectiles at M118LR velocity, (yes, I've seen and repaired the results once. He was lucky.), are beating their old rifles to death. Stick with the 155 grain Palma Match SMK and you should be fine.
    I think it is also relevant to point out that "what it says on the tin" is 7.62 NATO and NOT 308 Win.

    Keep the pressures down by using what is was designed to use.
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    Mine are not the best, but they are not too bad. I can think of lots of Enfields I'd rather have but instead of constantly striving for more, sometimes it's good to be satisfied with what one has...

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    Advisory Panel Brian Dick's Avatar
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    30Three, You probably need a set of .308/7.62 match gauges. The L39/L42 gauges are 1.628 Go and 1.635 No-Go.

    ---------- Post added at 06:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:06 PM ----------

    AdE, The .308 vs. 7.62 debate is a can of worms. To be honest, I've been interchanging them for more years than I can remember in both bolt rifles and semi-autos and have never had a problem. The same goes for .223 vs. 5.56. Many make a big deal out of it and in my opinion, it's not. The key is to use common sense and know your ammo and chamber pressures, especially if shooting Lee Enfield's.

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    Really Senior Member Daan Kemp's Avatar
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    Agree with you on the military vs commercial ammo debates. Interesting it never happens with 30-06, 303, 30-40 Kragicon, 9x19, 45ACP, etc. Only 308/7,62 and 223/5,56.

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    Really Senior Member Alan de Enfield's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian Dickicon View Post
    The key is to use common sense and know your ammo and chamber pressures, especially if shooting Lee Enfield's.
    Agreed.

    The problem comes when folks don't realise what the rifle was built to use and start using other ammunition (hotter, heavier bullets etc).
    Its like your car and all its components are built to use a (say) 3 litre 300hp engine, you change it out for a 6 litre 600hp engine and then wonder why the clutch starts to slip, the geartrain components cannot handle the power, the tyres loose traction etc.
    Mine are not the best, but they are not too bad. I can think of lots of Enfields I'd rather have but instead of constantly striving for more, sometimes it's good to be satisfied with what one has...

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    Senior Member pocketshaver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daan Kemp View Post
    Agree with you on the military vs commercial ammo debates. Interesting it never happens with 30-06, 303, 30-40 Kragicon, 9x19, 45ACP, etc. Only 308/7,62 and 223/5,56.
    the issue with these cartridges, .308/7.62x51 and the .223 debacle is that there have been so many versions of the same cartridge given different pressure levels.

    take the 7.62x51 cetme that spain created. good round, but used light bullets at high velocity. chambers identical to .308/51 nato, but not safe for it. thus lots of issues with the converted 1916 Spanish Oviedo mausers.

    .223 and 5.56, the standard ball round of 55 grain IS the exact cartridge released as .223 Remington. That has been admitted by saami SO MANY TIMES its not funny. the only issue is that....

    1.there have been two updated versions of the 5.56 nato that increased NATO pressure chamber EPVAT testing limits to deal with increased bullet weights.

    2. ORIGINAL Vietnam production M16s given the original chamber and .223 ammunition SAFETLY use the higher pressured forms of 5.56 nato that are supposedly unsafe in .223 Remington chambers

    3. CIP declares .223 Remington and 5.56 nato to BE THE SAME CARTRIDGE and firearms MUST be safe to use with both.

    4. ARs with .223 Remington on the barrel are actually given 5.56 nato chambers. And people have discovered DECADES ago that any modern rifle with a .223 ONLY needs a few minutes of touchup with a 5.56 nato finish reamer to get the lead taken care of , and can instantly use ANY 5.56 cartridge

    5. SAAMI ONLY uses the original .223 Remington pressure levels.

    6. commercially produced 5.56 nato ammunition, even the 55 gr fmj clones are allowed to be loaded to ANY of the 3 nato pressure levels. Thus they are not actually safe to use in an unmodified chamber.
    I got that from SAAMI and Federal Cartridge



    7. only way to get actual mil spec 55 gran fmj is to have it come with a nato head stamp. No one is techinically sure if the IMI 55 grn fmj meets original spec

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