+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 21

Thread: Stupid Question

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #1
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Last On
    Today @ 12:08 AM
    Location
    Desert Hot Springs, California
    Posts
    671
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    06:17 AM

    Stupid Question

    I was at my local gun store today. I noticed what appeared to be a sporterized LE No4 MkI. It definitely was not a No5 and was clearly marked as a Longbranch No4 MkI on the receiver with a date of 1942. The barrel appeared to be a different color metal, had a later model commercial ramped front sight and there were 2 holes drilled into the top of the receiver ring (possibly for a scope?). The stock was not the standard full length forestock (it had a rounded tip painted black ending about halfway down the barrel and no upper handguard). I advised the shopkeeper that it was a sporterized rifle and he assured me he was told it was a factory correct model of the No4.



    Thus, the stupid question - other than the No5, did Lee Enfield ever make and distribute a No4 rifle that did not have a full forestock and upper handguard? I'm pretty sure I know the answer, but as I have already learned, the cool thing about LE's is that there are all kinds of variants and I don't know them all. Thanks!

  2. # ADS
    Friends and Sponsors
    Join Date
    October 2006
    Location
    Milsurps.Com
    Posts
    All Threads
    Banner AD Space Available - Click HERE to Inquire LIMITED TIME OFFER FROM THE AMERICAN GUNSMITHING INSTITUTE: Get Immediate Online Access To AGI's NEW Armorer's Course for Glock Pistols, Covering Every Generation of Glocks, Including the Latest Model 42/43 and Double Stack Pistols for ONLY $7.00! Brian Dick ... BDL Ltd. - Specializing in British and Commonwealth weapons Chuck in Denver ... Buy-Sell-Trade .. Guns, Cars Motorcycles Your source for the finest in High Power Competition Gear. Here at T-bones Shipwrighting we specialise in vintage service rifle: re-barrelling, bedding, repairs, modifications and accurizing. We also provide importation services for firearms, parts and weapons, for both private or commercial businesses.
     

  3. #2
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:40 PM
    Location
    Victoria BC
    Posts
    26,006
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    04:17 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Singer B View Post
    he was told it was a factory correct model of the No4.
    Sporterized perhaps by one of the groups that did them. "He was told"... Now, pics on the other hand might help?
    Regards, Jim

  4. Avoid Ads - Become a Contributing Member - Click HERE
  5. #3
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Last On
    Today @ 12:08 AM
    Location
    Desert Hot Springs, California
    Posts
    671
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    06:17 AM
    Thread Starter
    Sorry, no pictures. I was aware of the "Santa Fe" rifles and thought maybe it was one of those, but it wasn't marked as such and it doesn't have a flash hider on it.

  6. #4
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:40 PM
    Location
    Victoria BC
    Posts
    26,006
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    04:17 AM
    Santa Fe were still done out of arsenal. If you look up the different sporters made by half dozen companies and the grades of them, plus Eaton's and Sears and a few others you'll likely see your example there too.
    Regards, Jim

  7. #5
    Advisory Panel Surpmil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last On
    @
    Location
    West side
    Posts
    3,893
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    04:17 AM
    The holes in the receiver ring for the Parker Hale two piece base is a hallmark of the "Sussex" and "Surrey" sporterizations done in the UKicon. A low-end job they were too.
    "Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened." W.L.S.C..

    "None need deceive a people determined to deceive themselves."

  8. #6
    Contributing Member Singer B's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Last On
    Today @ 12:08 AM
    Location
    Desert Hot Springs, California
    Posts
    671
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    06:17 AM
    Thread Starter
    So they ate all aftermarket modifications? Thanks for all of the info!

  9. #7
    Really Senior Member Alan de Enfield's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Last On
    Today @ 02:54 AM
    Location
    Y Felinheli, Gogledd Cymru
    Posts
    2,108
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    12:17 PM
    There were 4 models (that I know of) that were based on No4 actions that had 'shortened / sporterised' wood work and were all manufactured by the original factories, these are the :

    L39A1 (Military issue 'target rifle')
    L42A1 (Replacement for the No4T)
    Envoy (Civilian version of the L39)
    Enforcer (Police issued version of the L42)

    The Enforcers were manufactured by Parker Hale / Enfield and used a variety of Actions, both new and used, including Long Branch (pictured) when The Enfield factory ran out of their own actions.

    The Police Enforcer used the Parker Hale 2-piece scope mounting system where the rear mount used the original rear sight mountings, but the front mounting used two holes drilled into the receiver ring.

    HOWEVER they are all in calibre 7.62 NATO and not 303, BUT they are all 'factory made' 'sportered' Lee Enfields.

    The 'sportered versions' of the No4 with front sight ramps are not to my knowledge factory manufactured as non were made using anything but the normal front sights, but maybe with a 'tube & ring sight' to replace the blade.

    Examples of my Enforcer & L42A1
    Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	Copy_of_DSC_enf_%281%29.jpg‎
Views:	123
Size:	166.7 KB
ID:	118105   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_8760.jpg‎
Views:	124
Size:	2.58 MB
ID:	118106   Click image for larger version

Name:	Long Branch Enforcer.jpg‎
Views:	114
Size:	302.9 KB
ID:	118107  
    Last edited by Alan de Enfield; 06-17-2021 at 04:03 AM.
    Mine are not the best, but they are not too bad. I can think of lots of Enfields I'd rather have but instead of constantly striving for more, sometimes it's good to be satisfied with what one has...

  10. #8
    Member bcd8238's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Last On
    Today @ 07:05 AM
    Location
    Queensland
    Posts
    27
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    09:17 PM
    Real Name
    Randall

    Re stupid question

    Just a WAG, but does the rifle look like this one? I think the EAL rifle was made on a later dated action, but maybe it was an inspiration for a copy?
    Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	EAL rifle.gif‎
Views:	116
Size:	56.7 KB
ID:	118108  

  11. #9
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 11:40 PM
    Location
    Victoria BC
    Posts
    26,006
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    04:17 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Alan de Enfield View Post
    There were 4 models (that I know of) that were based on No4 actions that had 'shortened / sporterised' wood work and were all manufactured by the original factories
    Those don't have a black painted forestock... I doubt those would have found their way to a shop like this one, besides he said no top wood...

    Quote Originally Posted by bcd8238 View Post
    the EAL rifle
    Would have been my only guess.

    Here's an example of the black front but not the one I wanted.
    Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	1.JPG‎
Views:	97
Size:	16.0 KB
ID:	118109  
    Last edited by browningautorifle; 06-17-2021 at 12:33 PM.
    Regards, Jim

  12. #10
    Advisory Panel breakeyp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 05:22 PM
    Location
    near Detroit Michigan
    Age
    75
    Posts
    919
    Local Date
    07-29-2021
    Local Time
    07:17 AM
    Black painted forestock tips was a hallmark of sporting rifle conversions done by Cogswell and Harrison (UKicon)after they were purchased by Interarms.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Stupid L4 question.
    By TactAdv in forum The Bren LMG (Light Machine Gun)
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 05-17-2020, 04:11 AM
  2. Stupid question
    By sakorick in forum M1903/1903A3/A4 Springfield Rifle
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-19-2017, 09:21 AM
  3. Stupid Question?
    By mrclark303 in forum Milsurps General Discussion Forum
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 04-21-2017, 08:15 PM
  4. Stupid Noob WASR-10 Question (assembly)
    By GS_Geoff in forum Soviet Bloc Rifles
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-16-2009, 10:36 AM
  5. How really stupid are you?
    By Cecil in forum The Watering Hole OT (Off Topic) Forum
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 04-10-2009, 07:03 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts