Possible Underwood Carbine Purchase

[oldfoneguy]

So the carbine is home and apart these are the pics I have so far. It's in excellent condition with an outstanding bore. As a shooter which is what I wanted for a first carbine it should be excellent.

The first two shots are the location and a close up of the import mark. No way that was filed off ! Next it seems to be an Underwood round bolt? Underneath very clean and nice appearance and oddly colored. Barrel band doesn't seem to be cut down but I don't know. Muzzle crown is nice with no cleanup on it. Op rod and it's markings. Sights and their markings. Overall a nice condition gun. A couple of bore and chamber shots. I'll post more later.

[USGI]

The front band does look like a "cut down" to me - inner piece extends a bit? I think the import mark is Arlington Ordnance. The Op Slide is an Inland. The bolt is a later Underwood replacement - that's the reason for the all Underwood internal pieces. Underwood produced a lot of those bolts and they're still seen for sale at times. - Bob

[oldfoneguy]

The front band does look like a "cut down" to me - inner piece extends a bit? I think the import mark is Arlington Ordnance. The Op Slide is an Inland. The bolt is a later Underwood replacement - that's the reason for the all Underwood internal pieces. Underwood produced a lot of those bolts and they're still seen for sale at times. - Bob

Bob would these bolts be completely assembled replacements that were just dropped in or were they shipped stripped and the parts transferred over?
I'm not noticing what you're referring to on the band. Would that be on the swivel or blank side?

[jimb16]

He is referring to the front edge of the inner band at the top of the barrel on the band. It extends out just a tiny bit beyond the outer band. On real type 2 bands the inner band face is very slightly recessed under the outer band edge. About the bolt: those bolts were usually packaged as complete bolts and were just drop in. Note: I said usually. I have seen them as stripped bolts too. Without disassembly, it would be hard to tell which you have. BUT, for purposes of a shooter carbine, it is a perfectly good bolt. It is a very typical post WWII rebuild. There is NOTHING wrong with that. It is part of the history of the carbine and should be considered to be "collectable" as it is. Not many of us would consider it for restoration. We would keep it as is and use it for shooting and competition. I have a couple like that in my collection, including import marked ones. (also Arlington Imports)

[USGI]

All the bolt parts are Underwood as strange as that sounds so they might have been directly changed over?

The later round bolts (yours) had a hole about midway along on the bottom and came with the late type extractor, ejector, and firing pin. If the parts in your bolt are the earlier designs, then they may have been changed over. I have a new .U. round bolt that I bought as a bare bolt in green colored wrap 17 years ago at a gun show. I think it was originally complete and someone removed the parts and wrapped it back up. I've never seen any evidence that Underwood packed bare post war bolts in boxes for shipping, but they may have. I do have some pics I found in 2011 of their boxed complete bolts.



I've never changed a barrel band, but have heard R&R on some front sights can be a real challenge. Original (Bayonet) Type 3 bands can be reasonably priced, but original Type 1 and Type 2 bands can run hundreds of dollars.

Now, I'm curious if you already had a bolt tool on hand or did you "pull it off" without one? - Bob

[oldfoneguy]

The later round bolts (yours) had a hole about midway along on the bottom and came with the late type extractor, ejector, and firing pin. If the parts in your bolt are the earlier designs, then they may have been changed over. I have a new .U. round bolt that I bought as a bare bolt in green colored wrap 17 years ago at a gun show. I think it was originally complete and someone removed the parts and wrapped it back up. I've never seen any evidence that Underwood packed the post war bolts in boxes for shipping, but they may have. I do have some pics I found in 2011 of their boxed complete bolts.

Attachment 132828Attachment 132827Attachment 132826Attachment 132825

I've never changed a barrel band, but have heard R&R on some front sights can be a real challenge. Original (Bayonet) Type 3 bands can be reasonably priced, but original Type 1 and Type 2 bands can run hundreds of dollars.

Now, I'm curious if you already had a bolt tool on hand or did you "pull it off" without one? - Bob

No sir no bolt tool yet. The seller is a professional gunsmith and had pics in his phone of when he had it completely apart. It's kind of hard to fudge the color of this thing if taking pictures of any other bolt. He's a retired Marine and a long time friend of my friend so he had no reason to lie to me especially not for a $1000 carbine.

[oldfoneguy]

So I finally got around to pictures of the stock, handguard, trigger group and magazine and that should cover this carbine. The seller included the sling and oiler as a gift, originally he wasn't going to. I'm heading to the range tomorrow and will post some target pics if they're not embarrassing.

First off handguard, no markings at all. Stock, no markings at all however the M2 fire selector slot is plainly visible. Somewhat typical of type 5 M2 pot belly stocks from what I've read. Buttplate, anyone care to guess the manufacturer? The plum colored Inland trigger group showing the M2 magazine latch. Last of all an original GI Underwood magazine
Any input is welcomed and expected boys.

[USGI]

Might be an NPM buttplate like the ones shown in this link They can be a bit puzzling! - Bob

https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=78376

[painter777]

Is there finish loss on the top of the left lug of your bolt ?

I ask after seeing your bottom view of receiver picture increased, it shows what appears to be filing where the bolts left lug would ride / rotate. Burrs are a issue to look for here since the bolts left lug rotation if it binds can lead to a broken right bolt lug. It's possible it had some burrs that were filed or sanded to smooth the area. Look and feel this area over closely. A piece of worn / oiled emery cloth works well to smooth the inside of the ledge out. Clean out all shavings and be sure to lightly grease both inside tracks that your bolt lugs ride in. Currently yours shows scars that extend outward, best they would run length wise with the rail.

Zoom in:

https://www.milsurps.com/attachment....7&d=1693421347

[oldfoneguy]

Is there finish loss on the top of the left lug of your bolt ?

I ask after seeing your bottom view of receiver picture increased, it shows what appears to be filing where the bolts left lug would ride / rotate. Burrs are a issue to look for here since the bolts left lug rotation if it binds can lead to a broken right bolt lug. It's possible it had some burrs that were filed or sanded to smooth the area. Look and feel this area over closely. A piece of worn / oiled emery cloth works well to smooth the inside of the ledge out. Clean out all shavings and be sure to lightly grease both inside tracks that your bolt lugs ride in. Currently yours shows scars that extend outward, best they would run length wise with the rail.

Zoom in:

https://www.milsurps.com/attachment....7&d=1693421347

Yes Charlie there is some degree of finish wear but nothing out of the ordinary. In fact what's there is really in line with my 1955 Garand and M1A (purchased new 1986). Here is another receiver picture from a slightly different angle. As you can see the marks are circular and are in fact an end mill from when the receiver was manufactured 80 years ago. From the dead on shot only showing that small triangle of the surface it looks infinitely worse than it actually is. However I appreciate your concern, thank you. BTW that surface holds grease excellently and the action is both slick and smooth.

I apologize for the delay responding, I've been out of town and couldn't respond with the appropriate photos.