No5 Jungle Carbine

[jeffreyasmith]

What I have been told about this gun

Issued to a Bought By Canadian Artilleryman late after the war
may have never been probably fired
I got it after his death from the friend of the original owner
the Bolt was missing at that time

Also has been refinished

So i am soliciting (More) Comments and Commentary

Ultimately what is the Approximate Value +/-

No 5 Jungle - jeffreyasmiths Photo Gallery - Military Surplus Collectors Forums


Update in post 19

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Roger Payne]

It's a genuine No5 & made at the Royal Ordnance Factory at Fazackerley, Liverpool, UK in August 1944, the first year of manufacture (they were made from 1944 to 1947 inclusive). However, I don't know about it being unfired. It's possible, but I doubt it judging by the wear to the finish on the metalwork. The wood has also been sanded - you can see it has been done, but there are still numerous stock 'dings' visible in spite of this. But it's certainly a real Jungle carbine, & like all old milsurps it has a value.

I'm not a jungle carbine 'expert' by the way - others may be able to chime in & tell you a lot more about it.......

[Alan de Enfield]

What I have been told about this gun

Issued to a Canadian Artilleryman late war
may have never been fired
I got it after his death from the friend of the original owner
the Bolt was missing at that time

So i am soliciting Comments and Commentary

No 5 Jungle - jeffreyasmiths Photo Gallery - Military Surplus Collectors Forums

As nice as the 'story' is there is an element of wishful thinking.
After the war the UK MOD sold it off into the UK civilian gun market (hence the UK civilian proof-marks), the some time after it was sold to a dealer in the USA - does it have any import marks ?

[jeffreyasmith]

Thank you for the Feedback
its just what I was looking for

I made sure to take pictures of all the marks (that i could find) that were on the gun
and please feel free to point out what the markings are
as i am not knowledgable as to what they are

but i am quite sure the person who owned it prior was Canadian Military
and it came right from him to me via his longtime friend

Perhaps he bought it as a sentimental piece similar to what he was issued
(i am not insistent at all about the story; the UK civilian proof marks refute it)
but other than the owners i am not aware of its previous life at all

[Seaspriter]

As nice as the 'story' is there is an element of wishful thinking.
After the war the UK MOD sold it off into the UK civilian gun market (hence the UK civilian proof-marks), the some time after it was sold to a dealer in the USA - does it have any import marks ?

The wood has also been sanded - you can see it has been done, but there are still numerous stock 'dings' visible in spite of this.

Jeffery -- a nicely refinished JC (I have two in VG-EX condition).

Alan de Enfield is correct (he's a recognized expert). The markings show it was surplused out of commission (proof marks of barrel pressure certification). Most likely it was purchased by your Canadian Artilleryman after the war (it normally wouldn't be issued to the artillery, as this was an Infantry gun). It's amazing how stories get a little embellished over the years after someone dies. (I have an M-1 Carbine with an almost identical, but embellished, story.)

Roger Payne (another recognized expert) identified the "refinishing" of the stock. As a antiques "restorer" I can affirm that the stock was undoubtedly sanded (which removed the wood's patina), then probably was bleached (thus the very light colour of the wood, which is not walnut's natural shade), and finally a coat of gloss varnish/polyurethane applied (Boiled linseed oil or Tung Oil would have been appropriate, although RLO would have been technically accurate, which would have left the wood with a satin finish).

It's more than likely been shot a few times (the war in Europe still had 6 months to go after the gun might have hit the battlefield) -- nothing to be concerned about as long as the barrel is shiny and it is within spec. Some of the JCs are very accurate shooters -- check out YouTube to see a few endorsements of their accuracy despite the "wandering zero" problem. Be sure to get the right replacement bolt with the hollowed out handle-ball.

Robert

[jeffreyasmith]

Please Keep the remarks coming
the commenters probably have forgotten more that i will ever know
and i appreciate their correction

as i said i am not Sticking to the "Story"
i much prefer the Facts of the gun as stated today and proven

[jeffreyasmith]

So my next question
What s the Approximate Value +/-
of a Refinished 1944 Jungle Carbine without a Bolt

[vintage hunter]

I got it after his death from the friend of the original owner
the Bolt was missing at that time

Bolt is probably still somewhere in the house. Lots of people listened to the propaganda about gun safety that went something like remove bolts/magazines and store in a separate part of the house and the ammo in yet another. Can't tell you how many I've seen come into my buddies pawn shop missing one or the other or sometimes both because the owner had died and the kids couldn't find the rest of the gun.

[jeffreyasmith]

Well it "lived" in the M.I.T. Faculty resident apartments over 24 years ago

No telling where it is now

He also had a Broom Handled Mauser

The Cambridge MA PD would have a field day

[Seaspriter]

What us the Approximate Value +/-
of a Refinished 1944 Jungle Carbine without a Bolt

See Lee Enfield No. 5 Mk 1 Jungle Carbine #5 : Bolt Action Rifles at GunBroker.com
for a JC sold recently that has the proper finish, arsenal repaired shortly after the post war in VG-EX condition. It sold for $368 (a very good price). Others in this condition will sell for $100-$150 more. A fair one will sell for $250-$275.