My 1945 Long Branch T!!!!

[Headhunter]

Hey guys ,
I am looking for some info on my new 1945 Long Branch T. I am trying to find out what the production numbers where in 1945 and before. Also there are markings on the scope Bracket that I am not shure about. One is an iron cross looking stamp and the other is a circle and arrow that was put on by hand(I am guessing). I was also was trying to find out what the retail value is on the gun based off of past sales. And any other info you guys may have.

Thanks in advance!!
Scott

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[rgg_7]

A few folks on this board own 1945 Long Branch "T's". If they could post their info it may answer your questions.

The 1945 LB T was a contract for the Uk and was mostly mounted with the No32 MK3 REL scope and was build on a block of Enfields in the 90L8xxx serial range.

Your scope bracket has the serial number milled off however it has the Canadian aceptance mark electropeniceled and the maltese cross for non standard part. It's unusual to see a Mk1 scope on a 1945 however there are lots of exceptions when it comes to these old snipers. Your forestock and sight should also have the maltese cross stamped on them....may also appear underneath the cheekpiece.

Do you have the scope case and transit chest ?

Nice rifle.

Ron

[Headhunter]

Hey Ron,
No I dont have the scope case and chest.....I bought the rifle in the UK....We are in the process of getting it here. I am very excited about getting it(finally). When you say non standard....what exactly does that mean. Is it not right for the gun?
Thanks for info!

Scott

[rgg_7]

Maltese cross signified "non standard" part ...meaning it was fitted to that rifle and not meant to be interchanged with another one. Som folks also call this this the Canadian or Long Branch sniper rifle symbol. Generally found on these rifles however it's been observed on on other weapons and items. Ron

[Headhunter]

Thanks Ron......That is quite helpful. Is there any place that I can find out the actual production numbers. Just how rare are the Long Branches? I am new to collecting and I am trying to soak up as much info as I can.........

thanks again
Scott

[Alan de Enfield]

Longbranch built 905,731 No 4 rifles (of which 1,141 were 'sniper' No4 T's)
Only 1000 REL scopes were manufactured.

Source : "An Armourers Perspective .303 No4(T) Rifle"
Peter Laidler

Its a book well worth buying - ISBN 1 85367 144 4

[Headhunter]

Thanks Alan

Holy cow ....I own that book!! And I never thought to look in it. I did now.....what do you need to know? ha ha! I dont know what I was thinking not looking in there............I must of had Long Branch on the brain....fogging up my thoughts!

Thanks for the help clearing my mind!

Scott

[Lee Enfield]

Long Branch production is estimated to be @1588 total.
Milsurps - 1945 Enfield No.4 Mk1*(T) Long Branch Sniper Rifle

Your rifle is a 90L8, 1 of @350 all produced with the C.No32Mk3 scope.

Your REL No32MkI scope is "probably" off of a 1944 produced 71L block sniper.

Your mount "could be" original to the scope, but not the 90L8 rifle.

The right side cap markings are "in my opinion" additions, I've seen Long Branch scope rings marked, but not numbered.

[Badger]

Long Branch production is estimated to be @1588 total. Your rifle is a 90L8, 1 of @350 all produced with the C.No32Mk3 scope. Your REL No32MkI scope is "probably" off of a 1944 produced 71L block sniper. Your mount "could be" original to the scope, but not the 90L8 rifle. The right side cap markings are "in my opinion" additions, I've seen Long Branch scope rings marked, but not numbered.

Although I'm a K98k collector, I concur with Lee Enfield, as my wife owns 2 LB snipers. The one you see in this MKL entry below and another that's only 18 serial numbers away from it.

1945 Enfield No.4 Mk1*(T) Longbranch Sniper Rifle
Serial # 90L8161 c/w matching Model No.32 Mk.3 R.E.L Canada Scope Serial # 174-C

(Click PIC to Enlarge)

The serial number on headhunter's in the first post shown is # 90L8299, so it's not far off either of hers. In both cases of her rifles, they have No.32 MKIII scopes and the mounts are serial number matched with no consecutive bracket numbers appearing on either either matched scope/bracket combo.

I suspect that this is an all correct 1945 Long Branch sniper with a mix-n-match earlier scope/bracket combo put on it at sometime, plus I'm not sure the markings on the scope bracket are original. I've never seen a hand scribed C-Broad Arrow marking on an LB scope bracket, nor a maltese cross on one either, but I could be wrong. I have seen the maltese cross on the forestock up front and underneath, plus on the rear folding sight.

(Click PIC to Enlarge)

As per the Knowledge Library entry research, I also think the quantity manufactured was ..

Qty Mfg: ...................... 992 (Accepted Production from 1941-45 by Department of Munitions and Supply)
Note: .......................... 1141 (Calculated total mfg estimates as of Dec 31/1945 in Laidler/Skennerton publications)

Just my two cents …

Regards,
Doug

[Lee Enfield]

Qty Mfg: ...................... 992 (Accepted Production from 1941-45 by Department of Munitions and Supply)
Note: .......................... 1141 (Calculated total mfg estimates as of Dec 31/1945 in Laidler/Skennerton publications)

Badger,
I think those figures are based on a misreading of the totals; the 992 (accepted production #) may be the number which the Canadian Army accepted, or alternatively those accepted for export...

Using data from Clive Law's book, (allegedly from the actual archives).

71 mfg up to Dec 31, 1943
1141 Jan 1 1944 to Dec 31 1945 (Note: Skennerton lists approximately 99 [of 350] No32TPs as being set up during early 1945)
@376 mfg by Canadian Arsenals Ltd 1946 (Note: Most or all being C.No.32 Mk3 scopes)

1588 total manufacture

Note: Only 1,524 scopes are recorded as having been produced & purchased by R.E.L. & DND respectively.

Law's conclusions are that the REL No.32 MkI, IA & II scopes are numbered CONSECUTIVELY, while the C.No.67 (No.32 MkIV), C.No.32 Mk3, and No.32TP run in their own sequences. Having said that, MkI, IA & II serials show limited (and unexplained) overlap (probably like a late numbered receiver with earlier features).

Laidler's original conclusion was that all serials had their own ranges, but I have been assured (by Law) that Laidler has since changed his mind to reflect Law's evidence. ....... Feedback by Advisory Panel Member "Lee Enfield".


Source: Without Warning - 20th Century Sniper Equipment of the Canadian Army, by Clive M. Law (2004), ISBN: 1-894581-16-4