Thread: Looked at a 1943 British Sniper.....looking for info on finish

[joezeta]

Met a nice older collector at a show today.....selling out a bunch of his stuff..... i bought some nice hard to find items....

On the back of his table i notice a Scope can, i ask what it was....said its British enfield sniper scope...... Said he had the rifle under the table...

Long story short, i know very little about these......i asked if it has the transit case that ive seen in the past.....he said no, he brought it back from Australia in 1986.....Brought in through his dealer, Small import mark " Hansens CT " i think he said when he got it he was told its was from the navy?

The rifle had some odd Grey finish.... i was expecting the black rattle can looking finish....... Scope had some cosmetic issues, but looks all there, had tool in the can as well..... Serial # matched the receiver and bolt....not the scope and not the stock...

My question is , with this one crappy pic i clicked off with my cell phone...... do these markings indicate this was a dedicated Sniper ? or is this a run of the mill enfield that a individual converted to a sniper.....i realize that correctly back then standard enfields were probably chosen to be used as snipers.... just wondering if these markings indicated something unique...

He had it marked 3900, but told me 3K since i bought alot......can possibly get it for less...

I remember Navy Arms bringing these in Years back.......

Any info from this crappy pic appreciated...

Wondering if any experts here have seen a finish like this applied by the military/armoury post service...or if this could have been done by the gunshop in Australia to perhaps help out the sale then......

Lastly ive seen scopes sell on there own, but if this rifle is correct, whats its approximate value if its all there.....taking into account the odd finish....

Thankyou, Joezeta

Thanks, Joe

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[Badger]

Welcome to the forums Joe .....

A good place to start learning about these would be checking the MKL for an article and detailed photo montage on an all correct example....

1944 Enfield No.4 Mk1(T) Sniper Rifle

You'll probably get a lot of expert feedback here and the usually, the more pics you post, the greater the quality of feedback and participation from members.

Regards,
Doug

[Warren]

The grey finish is a post war Belgian Teflon type finish........you will find it slippery to the touch.

[joezeta]

Thanks Warren, So this rifle was used post war in Belgium ?

[Badger]

Thanks Warren, So this rifle was used post war in Belgium ?

As jmoore mentioned .....

You might want to try our Google CSE custom search engine located in the top right corner below the words "Advanced Search". It only searches our site using Google techniques and can be quite efficient. For example, in your case, type in the words belgium no.4 and see what happens ..

There are several threads, many with pictures. Here's just one example

Any issues with this Longbranch No.4 Mk 1 T

Regards,
Doug

[joezeta]

Incredible information here, Thanks to everyone for pointing me in the right direction.

Joezeta

[joezeta]

I do not know if its a AOL thing, but i cannot for the life of me Find the Search/Advanced Searched icon on my screen....


Perhaps i will try internet explorer....

Thanks...

[paulseamus]

Joezeta

On a No4 (T), the rifle serial number stamped on the wrist of the receiver will ideally match the serial number stamped on the bolt handle, the serial number painted on the scope can/tin and the serial number that is sometimes (not always) stamped on the scope bracket.

Ideally the scope serial number, engraved on the scope body, will match the number stamped on the rifle butt, at the top just behind the wrist.

As the scopes were custom fitted to each rifle, the scope number was recorded on the rifle butt, to ensure that the correct scope was kept with the rifle. Over time some Armourers recorded the rifle serial number on the scope mount.

With many of these rifles being sold on-masse, the vendors did not always worry about matching the scopes with the rifles, so today we have many mismatched sets.

There are a lot of signs to tell if the rifle is the genuine article or a copy.

From your pic it is hard to tell but the pads and the TR stampng look genuine. The matching finish would indicate that the pads were fitted prior to the rifle being re-finished.

The link that Badger has given you above will help you with other tell tale markings, both on the timberwork and on the body of the reciever.

There is also a very good book, that I would recommend, by Peter Laidler, that details the history and all of the markings. It is available in the US though Brian at BDL Ltd. "An Armourers Perspective- 303 No 4(T) Sniper Rifle and the Holland and Holland Connection"

Here is the link to BDL Ltd. Books

When you buy the book from BDL, also order "Telescope Sighting No.32" by Peter Laidler. this great little book is a treasure trove of information on the scopes fitted to the No4 (T) sniper rifles.

If you are happy with the price of the rifle, which if genuine seems fair, try to hold it with a small deposit. Buy the book. Check the finer details as per the book and this website, and then make the decision whether to complete the purchase.

Or take a heap more detailed photos and post them here so that Milsurps members can guide you.

Cheers

Paul

[jmoore]

We've had some previous threads on the Belgian issued No.4s. There should be photographs within that ought to be helpful.

The serial number on the butt socket on the example above looks to have been applied Post WWII, but otherwise there's nothing that jumps out at me as being anything other than what it is supposed to be. Probably a good rifle.

[joezeta]

Thanks Doug, i currently do not see anything like that......i'll see what can be done......