NPM Carbines and Umderwood parts

[ewall]

There are identified instances where NPM used Underwood parts. Is there any evidence that Underwood Recoil Plates were used in the second production block in the fall of 1943? My NPM M1's S/N 1955104 places it in the 2nd production block with a NPM Trimble (TN) stock that shows no decay or damage inside the stock at the recoil plate. Why would an armor change a recoil plate when replacing a rear sight? (The sight and sear seem to be the only non-original parts.)

Information

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[painter777]

NPM requested recoil plates (part no. C57150 ) from Underwood:

7000 early/old style recoil plates on 9-2-43
10,000 early/old style recoil plates on 10-1-43
5,000 new style recoil plates on 10-1-43

These being *Request Dates* not documented delivery dates.

Sears from Inland to NPM (part no. B200978):

50 on 11-9-42
550 on 11-9-42
1 on 4-13-43
These also being *Request Dates* not documented delivery dates.

Above Information pulled from Larry Ruths War Baby.

Lots of sub contractor to sub contractor swapping went on.
Maybe possible the recoil plate was supplied from UEF to Trimble.
HTH,
Charlie-painter777

[ewall]

NPM requested recoil plates (part no. C57150 ) from Underwood:

7000 early/old style recoil plates on 9-2-43
10,000 early/old style recoil plates on 10-1-43
5,000 new style recoil plates on 10-1-43

These being *Request Dates* not documented delivery dates.

Sears from Inland to NPM (part no. B200978):

50 on 11-9-42
550 on 11-9-42
1 on 4-13-43
These also being *Request Dates* not documented delivery dates.

Above Information pulled from Larry Ruths War Baby.

Lots of sub contractor to sub contractor swapping went on.
Maybe possible the recoil plate was supplied from UEF to Trimble.
HTH,
Charlie-painter777

So there is a chance the recoil plate in my M1 left the factory that way. The BI sear is likely a replaced item. Would it be inappropriate to secure a NPM sear from a reputable source?

[ewall]

So as I re-read Charlie's identification that 601 Inland sears were supplied to NPM in 1942-43, there is no way I'm taking any chances on potentially altering a Carbine that could have left the factory exactly as it now stands (except for the flip sight). However, would it be dishonest or inappropriate to secure an original NPM flip sight to return the rifle to its original condition even thought the adjustable sight was staked. No, I am not thinking of ever selling this piece. I am ok with the milled sight not being original. I am just curious as to how far one would go to recreate an M1?

[DaveHH]

My 5.6 Winchester is all W and as made. It has one non W part: an AU recoil plate. Winchester received 5,000 recoil plates from Underwood in Nov 43 and my carbine was made Mar 44. There is another near mirror carbine in the data base with an Underwood RP, made at about the same time. Another way to tell if the RP is native to the stock is to look at the etching in the wood under the plate. There will be matching marks in the wood for every machine mark on the plate. If it is original to the stock it will be VERY hard to remove as well.

[ewall]

My 5.6 Winchester is all W and as made. It has one non W part: an AU recoil plate. Winchester received 5,000 recoil plates from Underwood in Nov 43 and my carbine was made Mar 44. There is another near mirror carbine in the data base with an Underwood RP, made at about the same time. Another way to tell if the RP is native to the stock is to look at the etching in the wood under the plate. There will be matching marks in the wood for every machine mark on the plate. If it is original to the stock it will be VERY hard to remove as well.

Thanks. In looking at the interior of the stock, it looks pristine around the area of the recoil plate. No scuffs or deformation around the recoil plate, just indentations where the plate resides. I am pretty confident this piece is original from the factory as the S/N is consistent when Underwood was delivering parts to NPM.

[painter777]

Why would an armor change a recoil plate when replacing a rear sight?

2 reasons I could think of...
1 being if the lock up to the receiver wasn't tight enough.
2nd being if it was a change over, swapping out the first style for the later/straight back one.
Cause he had a hard nosed Sgt standing over his shoulder.

As for the adj site. For shooting I much prefer. If shooting at someone because they are shooting at me or buddies, Type II or III sight would be most desired. Don't beat yourself over a misc part, many original internal parts have been swapped out thus tossing true history.

JMHO,
CH-P777

[painter777]

It's your call on the sear, just remember when parts go in the parts bins...... they do get buried over with more incoming parts.
Swap it if you want, but I'd hang on to the one coming off and tag it.

BTW, Your Recoil plate looks to fit well enough. I try to keep the under side edge clean of grime.

Cheers and nice NPM... Happy New Year..

Charlie-Painter777

[ewall]

It's your call on the sear, just remember when parts go in the parts bins...... they do get buried over with more incoming parts.
Swap it if you want, but I'd hang on to the one coming off and tag it.

BTW, Your Recoil plate looks to fit well enough. I try to keep the under side edge clean of grime.

Cheers and nice NPM... Happy New Year..

Charlie-Painter777

Thanks, and I intend to take good care of it!
Happy New Year!

Ted

[deldriver]

Personally, I wouldn't change any parts on this carbine since it already has the adjustable rear sight and changing other parts won't add to the value on this carbine. I mean if it still had a flip sight on it as it originally did then sure, go ahead and make the sear change if you want to, but this is such a nice, almost original carbine that I'd just leave it alone. BTW, I have a NPM in the I.51 range that is almost all NPM, (dogleg hammer included) but the stock and handguard are both wrong. I'd love to find the correct furniture one day, but I'm extremely content where I am right now.