Enfield bolt bodies for sale on e-bay UK FAC holders BEWARE.

[Simon P]

I do send quite a few to Birmingham for certification of deactivation, they now apply proof house serial numbers to guns that do not have serial numbers and were previously recorded as NVN (no visible number), thankfully they have the sense to apply the new number below the wood line

[mrclark303]

One of the (many) problems with the deactivation specification(s) is the lack of any specifications for component parts. That is to say ONLY a whole, un-mucked-about-with gun can benefit from the legislation; for example there is no specification for the Bren second barrel, only a complete gun. (This specific issue may have been fixed by now.)

So, as I see it, all the time a component is part of a deact it benefits from the status of that gun. Remove it and reverts to being "any component part".

This movement of items between Firearms Act Sections based on context is not unusual e.g. A Smith & Wesson Hand Ejector in .445 can be: Section 5, Section 7(1) or Section 7(3) entirely dependent on context. Alternatively, an SLR is Section 5. Strip it down for components and they become the following types: no license required (e.g. the furniture), Section 1 (e.g. the breech-block), Section 5 (e.g.the gas ported barrel).

an SLR is Section 5. Strip it down for components and they become the following types: no license required (e.g. the furniture), Section 1 (e.g. the breech-block), Section 5 (e.g.the gas ported barrel).

An interesting point regarding Sec 5 firearms.... A stripped down L1A1 is in fact all Sec1, even the gas parts, it only becomes Sec 5 when assembled.

The only Firearms with Sec 5 components are handguns !

[Peter Laidler]

Mmmmmmm..... So you are saying that, say, an AR15/M16 barrel is a S.5 component part per-se? Better not tell that to all those who own those 5.56 bolt action CAM rifles then!

If that is fact, that if you take a part OFF a deact then it reverts to its previous spec, (Beery's thread, para 1 and 2 above) such as an L1A1 flash eliminator immediately becoming a prohibited part in its own right. Then someone had better tell the Judge at Winchester C Ct to get reading up his law books because he disagreed and threw out the case of the bayonet collector who had one to illustrate his bayonet collection - taken off a deactivated L1A1.

My lovely sister told me something interesting this morning about laymen and even the Police quoting Criminal Law. You can NEARLY right, but in being so, you can be HOPELESSLY wrong!

[Peter Laidler]

Re the deactivated Bren barrels being allowed as a separate entity. Whether that was a mistake or not, the stable door has been well and truly opened and it would need legislation to close. The fact that............. anyway, you simply cannot chop and change to suit the whim of a proofmaster. Think about it........ In short, if that REALLY were the case. you could have the ridiculous situation of a person being sent to prison for possessing one when his neighbour has one - and is legally fireproof because the proofmaster said it'd be OK.

Yep, it's a *** but generally speaking, it works because it is what it is!

[ZGB]

Brit Plumber is correct about old spec de-acts being given new certs after inspection by the proof house without having to upgrade the de-act to new spec. At one time it was retrospective and old spec de-acts without a cert had to be upgraded. Common sense prevailed and this is no longer policy. The submited de-act does have to carry a valid de-act proof mark other wise it will have to be upgraded.
Regards component parts I can only quote the 2010 revised de-act specs.
Under Schedule 5
Special deact specs applying to smg's,machine pistols, automatic rifles, centre-fire self loading rifles and carbines and any other arms based upon the design or action of prohitited weapons within this category of firearms.
Page 18 of 47 last paragraph

Unaltered firearm components which are not major components, whilst remaining part of a de-acted firearm, are covered by the Firearms (Amendment) act 1988 and are treated as components of a deactivated firearm.
Should any of these components be removed and no longer remain part of a de-act firearm, it cannot fall within the exemption for de-act firearms in the firearms(Amendment) act 1988 and must revert to its original status.

[Beerhunter]

Just had a chance to speak to my sister, a now retired Barrister, regarding the strange case of end line 3/line 4 thread 21. You do NOT need a FAC of any sort to OWN a firearm. You need one simply to POSSESS a firearm.

I guess you sister did not specialise in firearms law then Peter because Under Section 1 (a) it is an offence for a person—

"to have in his possession, or to purchase or acquire, a firearm to which this section applies without holding a firearm certificate in force at the time, or otherwise than as authorised by such a certificate;"

Buying or acquiring moves ownership from one party to another.

[Beerhunter]

The only Firearms with Sec 5 components are handguns !

I am afraid that you last sentence could not be more wrong. Section 5 covers a lot more than handguns and even includes devices that are NOT even fireams!

[Peter Laidler]

PM sent Beery........... but for clarity, where in this quote (thread 46, para 2) does it say you need a certificate to OWN one. 'OWN' doesn't mean, indicate or imply possession. I could OWN one held on my brothers FAC!!!!!!!!!

[Alan de Enfield]

I am afraid that you last sentence could not be more wrong. Section 5 covers a lot more than handguns and even includes devices that are NOT even fireams!

Example :- Soft point bullet heads (components of ammunition) are section 5 and also counts towards you ammunition allowance even when not 'assembled' into ammunition

[Alan de Enfield]

PM sent Beery........... but for clarity, where in this quote (thread 46, para 2) does it say you need a certificate to OWN one. 'OWN' doesn't mean, indicate or imply possession. I could OWN one held on my brothers FAC!!!!!!!!!

I had a very similar discussion with a couple of RFD's when I was buying a rifle (but not a person to person transfer).

The rifle could not be shipped to me as a 'private individual'. (can only be shipped RFD to RFD)
I was awaiting the grant of an additional 'slot' on my FAC
I (obviously) had to pay for the rifle before the RFD would ship it to my local RFD

It was then pointed out that after I had paid for it , I owned a firearm for which I did not have a licence - technically illegal
If you own a rifle then you must be licensed for it.

As it happened (and apparently a common 'loop-hole') the rifle is shipped to the other RFD, but is not shown as being sold until the grant of the variation and the rifle collected from the receiving RFD

Any person wishing to possess, purchase or acquire any firearm or ammunition must hold
a valid firearm or shotgun certificate (as appropriate) unless exempt under sections 7 to 13,
15, 54 or 58(1) of the 1968 Act or sections 15 to 19 of the 1988 Act,