viet nam era shot gun

[lboos]

Im a newbe to military shotgun's,
What would be the most common 12 guage riot/trench gun used during the viet nam war? And would the military police have used a diff. model then the ord. grunt in the grass [longer/shorter barrel] ? Thank's.

Information

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[442nd]

not sure what was more common. My father had a stevens issued to him and then an ithaca after his stevens had been damaged in the field. the only military shotgun I personally own is an 1965-66 Ithaca duckbilled shotgun.

[Rob13]

A pile of WWII/Korean War era shotguns of various kinds went over there. There were some 45000 or so Stevens 77E pump shotguns(no heat shield) specifically made during Vietnam era that made it over there. They show up in US every so often as about 5000 did not go to Vietnam.

[HotTom]

The Stevens 77E and the Ithaca 37 were the "in production" riot shotguns used by the military in Vietnam. I was an MP and we had both (the Stevens was a cheap gun, the Ithaca was highly prized, though). No, we didn't have any special shotguns, we were just meaner than the grunts (and much better looking)

There were many WWII shotguns issued and carried, however, including some that weren't supposed to be in the inventory any more but, of course, were.

There probably were some Remington 870s in country late in the war.

"may father carried"?????????

Yikes!



HT

[lboos]

HotTom,
While you were in vietnam in the MP's how did you guy's secure your riot gun on your M151 jeep's ? Were they mounted under the windshield or in the M-16 mount? The reason i ask is i own a 67 M151 vietnam era jeep that i use in parades, show's etc, and it's being displayed as a MP jeep. Sat. i bought a remmington model 10 with a 20 in barrel at a gun show and thought it would look good with the jeep.
The model 10 sn# is U142695, anyone know when it was made? Thank's
New to shotguns.

[HotTom]

I don't recall any mount that went on the windshield (like the WWII leather scabbards for the Garand and carbine).

We had the M16 mounts and used them for both rifles and shotguns. Shotguns were more often carried in town patrols. Frankly, they most often were locked in the arms room and we carried M16s and, of course, the M1911A1, finest military pistol ever designed!

Problem with those rifle mounts were the springs were very strong and it took some serious yanking to get the weapon out. Mostly we carried them with the butt on the floor and the rifle or shotgun barrels leaning on the seat or against our legs.

I have a M151A2 set up as late Vietnam (it came with a ROPS kit and I kept the roll bar in (wonder why no one thought of that decades earlier?) but not the webbing. I have a dummy M60 with the correct pedestal and pintle (took me years to find those, they're very rare and cost about $1,000 -- not counting the dummy gun -- when you can find them).

Some of the other goodies also are expensive if you can find them -- red light, siren, a correct fire extinguisher was a couple hundred bucks and again took me years to find. I recently found an M1969 flak vest cheap at a gun show and it now rides on the back of the driver's seat, which is where they usually were carried when not worn.

So, as you know, it's an ongoing hobby and there's always something it "needs."

I don't do parades but I do take it to a couple of MV shows a year and park it. I have both a Stevens 77E (not pristine but very rare) and a Vietnam era Ithaca (unfired!) that I wouldn't risk losing. I stick an airsoft M16A1 in the rifle rack and it looks amazingly real (plastic!)

I spent five years on active duty starting in 1967 and 23 years in the Army Reserve (went back for Desert Storm and commanded a PW cage in Kuwait and we were still using M151s although the Humvees had replaced it in most units).

A guy named Jim Stewart put together a video and a web site (mostly the same photos) that may give you some ideas on outfitting your vehicle (you'll only see a few shotguns; mostly M14s, M16s, M79s and M60s on the gun jeeps):

video:

The Military Police of the Vietnam War on Vimeo

web site:

Homepage,Military Police of the Vietnam War

You may notice the basic MP vehicle patrol was 3 MPs in a jeep. That hasn't changed with the Humvees.
You'll also see lots of V-100 armored cars. There often are some for sale but not in my price range. They have been replaced in the MPs by an updated version, also made by Cadillac Gage.

If you have an M151A1, those vacuum lines to the wipers beneath the windshield were used to hold all kinds of stuff: Cigarette packs (most of my guys smoked Kools, which certainly kept me from bumming any), notebooks, bug juice. We rarely carried pioneer tools (axe and shovel) because they were too easy to steal. For a real authentic look, you need to get a black grease pencil and scribble call signs, radio frequencies, map coordinates, etc. on the inside of your windshield. The windshield served as our notepad for anything important coming in on the radio

This may help with your Remington (the month and date actually are on it already):

Remington Manufacture Dates

Long rant but I hope something there helps.

HT

[lboos]

HT, What a great video of the MP's in vietnam, saw a few riot guns there also, thanks for all the great info. i know the model 10 is probley to old to have been in vietnam but i still think it would look good on the jeep for display, Welcome home.

[Tom Doniphon]

Your Remington Model 10 falls into the range of the WW1 guns.

Can you tell us if the barrel is marked "10-A", "10-R", or has neither of those marks on it?

[lboos]

Tom,
My shotgun has a Model 10-A on top of the barrel and it has a large U over the sr#, and a B on the left side of the barrel very close to the rec. about a 1/2 foward of the B it has the letter's MO- cannot make out the last letter.

[Tom Doniphon]

The "10-A" designation means it's either a trench gun or long barreled gun converted to a riot gun.

Does it have a screw hole on either side of the barrel extension next to the receiver? If so, it's a a converted trench gun. The screw holes may be filled in or might even still have the screws in them. The holes were to attach a kind of metal flange on top of the barrel extension which the rear of the wood heat shield fit into.