1917 Enfield- Help! stuck bolt

[bisleyboy]

Hello fellow enthusiasts- I am new to the P17. I recently acquired a nice P17, mostly Remington manufacture. The bolt it came with was an Eddystone, so, I found a Rem bolt and purchased it. When I put it in my rifle, it fit fine, I pulled the trigger, and now my bolt is locked up tighter than a drum. It's as if the safety were in the bolt locked position, it will not budge. I thought I would ask the experts before I tear into this thing. Thanks in advance for your help. Steve

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[browningautorifle]

I would start by taking the trigger group out and that may release the bolt. First drop the floor plate out of the mag. Then remove the front and back screws and it will come out.

[Patrick Chadwick]

It's as if the safety were in the bolt locked position, it will not budge.

That is quite possibly the cause. Have a really good search through this forum - I have the feeling that this problem has been described before.

As browningautorifle wrote, you will have to dismantle the rifle. Remove the barrelled system from the stock. At the back of the safety lever there is a small screw set into a triangular piece of steel. Removing this is the key to dismantling the safety mechanism.

Go right to the top of this forum.
Download the manual in pdf-format and print out the pdf pages 8+9 (showing the manual pages 16-17 and 18-19).
Remove the safety lock holder screw (FIG. 49 on P.18 of the manual).
Remove the safety lock holder (FIG. 48).
Remove the spring (FIG. 46) and the plunger (FIG. 45). This may require fiddling with bits of wire to hook them out. I am not sure, and I am not going to dismantle my best-shooting service rifle to find out, but I think there may be a tiny hole at the front of the boss on the receiver, so that you can push the plunger out with a steel pin. If not, you will have to hook out the spring and then use fine-nosed pliers to grasp the plunger shaft and pull it out.

Looking at FIG. 43, you can see that the shank of the safety lock has a kind of eccentric groove (B-D in FIG. 43) and the plunger operates by pressing the detent E into this groove. So the plunger must be removed in oder to be able to pull out the safety lock. The bolt must then come free. Unless something is broken off and jammed in there!

I am giving you all this detail, because if all these steps do not work, then you have found the source of the trouble. Something in the safety mechanism is probably broken or badly burred.

Good luck, and take it slowly - no brute force!

Patrick

[Chuckindenver]

i would have to see your rifle for sure, sounds like someone has fiddled with the old bolt , new bolt, or other part of the fire control, or....you have a P14 bolt.

[Cosine26]

Bisleyboy
I have seen this problem before on this same forum and was able to diagnose and provide corrective action. Send me a PM with your e-mail address and I shall forward the information. I believe that your cocking piece and original bolt have been converted to cock-on-opening and the new standard bolt will not work with the modified cockinig piece. If you remove the action from the stock and remove the trigger zssembly and are able to open the bolt, I believe that this is the problem. If so , a new standard cocking piece will solve the problem. I need your e-mail because I do not know how to post ictures on this forum.
Hope this helps.

[Patrick Chadwick]

I have seen this problem before on this same forum and was able to diagnose and provide corrective action.

That must have been what I was vaguely remembering, but could not find. How about posting the thread title or a link for the enlightenment of us all?

Patrick

[Cosine26]

I posted that thread a long time ago and have no idea where it is or what the URL is. I shall try to dig up the info and post it on this thread a little later. Hope that helps.
VR
C.O.

[Cosine26]

Hi,
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o...ne1/M1917A.jpg
[url="http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o15/Cosine1/M1917B.jpg"]http://i116.photobucket.com/album
Let me venture my opinion into what your problem is. If you will examine the sear and trigger assembly you will see on the forward part of the sear there is a pin. This pin is supposed to keep you from firing the rifle unless the bolt is in the fully locked position. If you will examine the bottom of the bolt, you will find a hole or detent. When the bolt is closed and the trigger is pulled, if the bolt is fully closed, the pin on the top of the sear assembly will fit neatly into this hole. The cocking piece has a cutout that allows the sear that engages the cocking piece to rise up under spring pressure when the trigger is released. This allows the “safety” pin to retract. If someone has modified the cocking piece so that this opening is closed you will encounter your problem. Starting with everything assembled and the bolt out of the rifle, if you insert the bolt and cock the rifle on closing, action will be fine. If you now pull the trigger and drop the firing pin, the safety pin will enter the hole in the bolt. If something like an altered cocking piece of a defective cocking piece blocks the rear of the sear assembly so that it cannot retract to under spring pressure, you will not be able to open the bolt. By removing the trigger-sear assembly, you remove the pin and the bolt can be opened. If you replace the trigger-sear assembly in the rifle, insert the bolt (with the defective cocking piece) you can insert the bolt, close the bolt (thereby cocking the firing pin) and then pull the trigger, the bolt will again be locked up. You will then have to remove the trigger-sear assembly from the rifle to open the bolt.
Hope this helps
/M1917C.jpg
Please refer to the pictures posted above.
*In picture No 1, the side view of the sear is Fig 68. When the trigger is pulled, the sear rotates about the sear pin hole “B” causing the sear nose “A” to go down and releasing the cocking piece nose (picture no 2, Fig 29 “D”) allowing the firing pin to fall. At the same time the safety stud “E” rises and enters the bolt hole (Picture No 3, Fig 14, item “O”) if the bolt is completely closed. (If the bolt is not completely closed, the rifle will not fire). Releasing the trigger will cause the sear spring Fig 70 (which fits over the safety stud <Fig 68 “E”>) to force the sear to return to battery. If the sear spring is missing, the sear may not return to battery and the safety stud remains in the bolt “O”, the bolt cannot be opened. Removing the trigger and sear assembly will allow the bolt to be opened as this removes the safety stud from the bolt. .
*If the cocking piece is normal, when the sear returns to battery, the sear nose “A” can enter the slot just forward of “F” (cocking piece ,picture 2, Figure 20). If the cocking piece is defective or has been modified and there is no slot forward of “E” the ser nose cannot rise to release the safety stud. And the bolt cannot be opened. Again removing the Trigger /Sear assembly will allow the bolt to open.
Since you indicated that you could open the bolt upon removing the trigger/sear assembly, I would assume that one of these conditions is a


possible cause of your malfunction.

Hope this is clear and helps. I am having some trouble geting the photobucket pisctures to attach but I hope that you get the idea.

[Cosine26]

I am having trouble getting the photobucket pictures to transfer in the above narrative, therfore I shall publish them here:
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o...ne1/M1917A.jpg
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o...ne1/M1917B.jpg
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o...ne1/M1917C.jpg
They may be out of order with respect to the narrative but you will get the idea.

[jmoore]

Does this help? (Cosine26's photos above- NOT MINE!)

I copied the "img" option rather than the "jpg".